Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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Onairb
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Onairb »

Bamaman wrote:Always love it when Alex spoils the prior day's FJ for those who haven't seen it yet.
It's his way of encouraging people to watch the show the same night it airs. ;)
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MarkBarrett
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by MarkBarrett »

Vanya wrote:
Leander wrote:
At least Dylan guessed a novel having something to do with trains, it had a non-zero chance of being correct.
Actually since the clue referred to a comment by the title character and trains don't talk, he had a zero chance of being correct.
Thomas the Tank Engine talks, and I believe has been the subject of Jeopardy clues.

Dammit, now I say die-lan for dylan.
Oh, we're playing talking trains? Puff 'N Toot and The Little Engine That Could?
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by reddpen »

MarkBarrett wrote:Running the category was no challenge.
No kidding. I've never read a single King book (just a couple short stories), and I ran that one with ease. Also ran Firestarter and Carrie in J, but just Atlantic in DJ.
MarkBarrett wrote:Yes, (Moe) Greene guessed for (Benjamin) Bugsy Siegel was hilarious...
Show of hands: Who knew Bugsy Siegel mainly from the Warren Beatty movie? I know it's come up before (sorry, Joon), but I have to consciously eliminate the other Bugsys, real (Moran, though he was really called Bugs) and fictional (Malone). Scott Baio FTL!
MarkBarrett wrote:I don't want to waste two poll slots to ask at the end of the week, so I'll ask here: Mitt or Glove? Mitt for me. And save the political stuff as November is long past.
If you're asking which term do learned baseball fans use for most players' handware, glove is correct. If you're asking which word came first out of my brain, I said mitt. The stuff we learned first seems to surface first (is memory a FIFO system?), and I grew up playing with a mitt.
MarkBarrett wrote:Yes, Reddpen you were right Dylan was a one-time champ. He played better today, so that was good enough for me to feel justified in my comments even though he found no DDs this time.
The way Dylan played in this game, I was all set to take back my rude dismissal in yesterday's thread, which I think had more to do with his puny DD wagers and lowball FJ wager than his evident knowledge, which as you noted yesterday was solid. He was even better today.

Side note: Is there any correlation between lowball DD wagers on a Monday show and similar wagers in episodes taped later that same day? Seems like Drew caught it from Dylan.

Judges: In "It" at 1K ("A public prayer, or a catalog of events"), any chance of credit for recital? I negged it, but it seems to almost kinda fit each half... I also negged with SD over AK, probably due to this.

Vanya: Bet you wouldn't say Die-lan Thomas the Tank Engine. (Writers: future B&A.)

Linear Gnome, according to this page your best name anagram is Enigma Loner... but yours is better. Glad you're so sanguine about the result--not sure I would be in your shoes (double meaning, that), but your way is healthier. And judging by the number of clams I had in DJ (10, or I'd list them), I'd guess your combined Coryat will be excellent.
In and out of the pool four times
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by stevo4212 »

Interesting game. Got all of the 2000 clues and almost nothing else. How often does that happen?

How about that? A nice easy FJ after a most difficult FJ. Kind of paid half attention to the Anna Karenina movie (the one that's in the AFI lists, not the new one), and understood almost none of it. I also tried to read Heart of Darkness, but didn't understand any of it. Might explain why I'm so bad at Jeopardy, eh?
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by stevo4212 »

Leander wrote:
At least Dylan guessed a novel having something to do with trains, it had a non-zero chance of being correct.
Actually since the clue referred to a comment by the title character and trains don't talk, he had a zero chance of being correct.
No, by Non-zero, Leander actually meant he had a negative chance of being correct. Haha.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Linear Gnome »

reddpen wrote:Linear Gnome, according to this page your best name anagram is Enigma Loner... but yours is better. Glad you're so sanguine about the result--not sure I would be in your shoes (double meaning, that), but your way is healthier. And judging by the number of clams I had in DJ (10, or I'd list them), I'd guess your combined Coryat will be excellent.
Confession: I think I put my name into an anagram server some years ago and I'm not sure Enigma Loner came out--I like that. Two I ruled out were Leering Moan and another whose first word would have been Enamel. :shock:

FWIW, I was three-for-three converting online tests to in-person auditions (Chicago 2007, KC 2009, Chicago 2012). I didn't know whether anyone would ever want to put me on TV, but I enjoyed the first two auditions enough that, when the third invitation came for a Saturday after school was out, I couldn't think of a reason not to go--I figured it would be fun, anyway. I can vouch for "speak up/keep the game moving/follow directions" as good advice once at the audition.

I still think of myself as a fast-talking New Yorker, and I was surprised how (comparatively) slow I sounded, though I made an effort to call the categories immediately (and we did clear the boards). Watching yourself on television is a trip and a half!
opusthepenguin wrote:I actually had to grab a piece of paper and do some algebra to figure out why "3(11800)-2(16200)=3000" amounted to the same thought process I was describing. It still seems kind of like magic to me that three times your score minus two times his would yield your maximum safe bet. Yet to you that was just the obviously efficient way of representing what we've been talking about. You math geeks are a hoot.
Another confession: I didn't derive that calculation myself--it can be found in the "Two-Thirds Rule" section of the glossary. What I meant to say was, "This was how I got the $3000 bet, and my thought process was what you described in the narrative before your spoiler bar."

Sorry if I'm monopolizing this thread--four months is a long time. Maybe Dylan and/or Drew will find their way here and comment. FWIW, they both seemed like nice, cool people. I tried to talk to everyone for at least a few minutes while waiting for others do do their Hometown Howdies, etc.

Also, I've already mentioned that this week taped on Oct. 29--I don't know why they put this taping cycle on Monday-Tuesday, but it was nice for me because I didn't have to get as many classes covered. The only bad thing was that most of the music and theater I would have been interested in were dark because it was a Monday--I ended up going to see Looper that night. In any case, the "tournament break" in taping was definitely after this--I assume they tried to schedule it during the holidays.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Bamaman »

In Drew's spot I would have considered betting $300. It does the following....

1. Wins on a sole solve if both make the MSB. (and would have produced a three way tie in this game).
2. Beats Ilene if we are both wrong and she makes the MSB.
3. Wins on a TS if Ilene makes the MSB and Dylan over wages by $600.

I considered $300 for him during the break. I always stop the DVR to plot out bets for all three players. That isn't a strong category for me but would really have been upset in his spot if a small wager cost me the game.
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Linear Gnome
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Linear Gnome »

reddpen wrote:Linear Gnome, according to this page your best name anagram is Enigma Loner... but yours is better.
I just went to wordsmith.org's anagram server--my name has a ridiculous number of anagrams. A few more I like are Lineman Ogre, Grannie Mole, Online Gamer, and Normal Genie.
OKlibrarian
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by OKlibrarian »

seaborgium wrote: I was going to make a post to respond to just that, but the board wonked out sometime in between my clicking the Quote button and the Submit button, and I pasted my reply elsewhere and distracted myself. But yeah, I was impressed too.

Here's how it works out (I know I'm preaching to the choir in your case, opus, but I'm just putting it out here):
We'll call first place's pre-FJ score f and second place's s.
If first place offers a tie to second, first's wager is 2s - f.
So if first is wrong, his score will be f - (2s - f) = 2f - 2s = 2(f - s), i.e. double first's pre-FJ lead.
If second is above 2f - 2s, it's a decent bet to try and remain above that. So the wager to do that is s - (2f - 2s) = s - 2f + 2s = 3s - 2f. There you go!
Thank you! this is helpful. I think based on my decent coryats and abysmal understanding of betting theory, I need to read up on wagering strategy before reviewing russian novels.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by silverscreentest »

CyrusChan wrote:I was surprised that the same case wasn't applied for his last name(Wint).
This is the only other Wint I could think of.

Image\

Mr. Wint, a hitman from Diamonds are Forever.
ebEliminator wrote: Is there a resource where you can study up without actually having to read all the books that might be considered?
This is a list of all the titles that have been asked in AP Literature exams since 1971. As far as plots you can go to Wikipedia.
MarkBarrett wrote:Oh, we're playing talking trains? Puff 'N Toot and The Little Engine That Could?
Don't get me started. In the 1990s, there was an entire kids show genre of anthropomorphic vehicles. Besides the trains, there were tugboats, planes and taxicabs.
Silver Screen Test, my movie trivia game show. Watch some of the episodes On-Demand.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by BigDaddyJ »

dhkendall wrote:Remember "France" was also a correct response, and it's east of most of Spain, not just Galicia (the part above Portugal). (Although, I guess that France borders the Bay of Biscay, not the Atlantic Ocean, per the conversation we had a few weeks back on this topic)
Even if one does not consider the Bay of Biscay to be part of the Atlantic Ocean (and I do), one could still make a case that the portion of France which juts out between the Bay of Biscay and the English Channel (i.e. Brittany) borders the Atlantic Ocean.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Sherm »

bpmod wrote:
ComingUpMilhouse wrote:They also do that standing upright behavior a lot, if you've ever seen them at a zoo.
And, of course, it follows, that if you haven't seen one at a zoo, they don't. :mrgreen:

Sorry, Sara. Couldn't resist.

Brian
OK, this is some of that tree falling forest crap, and I never hear one of those things. It ticks me off, because I'm never right.

Hey, do meerkats make a sound? Probably not, I've never heard one. :D
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Rex Kramer »

silverscreentest wrote:
CyrusChan wrote:I was surprised that the same case wasn't applied for his last name(Wint).
This is the only other Wint I could think of.

Image\

Mr. Wint, a hitman from Diamonds are Forever.
Just before he says, "Hey, Bond! Get your damn hands off her!"

:)

Rex
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by skullturf »

TryphonTournesol wrote:...And the westernmost point on mainland Spain is at nine degrees, 18 minutes West, while the westernmost point on mainland Portugal is at nine degrees, 30 minutes West - in other words, a fifth of a degree, which translates roughly to a difference of just 14 miles! I personally went with Portugal because I just sensed that it was more likely to be right in that spot - and because I pictured the jutting portion that contains Cabo da Roca, which as it happens is the westernmost point in mainland Europe. I didn't realize at the time how close Spain came, though. This was a pretty classic example of a "binary screw," with the best reason to choose Portugal being simply that it was a $2000 clue and thus less likely to be as "obvious" as Spain. Or if they gave a start year for the dictatorship other than 1936; since the Spanish Civil War pretty famously started in that year, any other year would thus have ruled Spain out.
Yeah. I didn't love this clue. In a way, you could say that it punished people for too much knowledge. If you have a detailed map in your head, then you know that it's an extremely close call between "Spain's westernmost point" and "Portugal's westernmost point". But if the map in your head is less precise, then you just know "Portugal is west of Spain" and therefore Portugal is probably the westernmost country in Europe.

Of course, it was the $2000 clue, so it's allowed to be tricky. And of course, there was other information in the question, such as the exact years that the country was a dictatorship.

I remember another geography question from the archives, from 2005, that I thought was surprisingly subtle. (EDIT: To be fair, I just noticed that this was in the Ultimate Tournament of Champions.) It's from this game and it was an $800 clue in the J! round (also a DD). The clue was:

"They're the 3 South American countries through which the equator passes."

I think naming 2 of those countries is relatively easy for trivia buffs. (One country is very large, and one country's name is a huge hint.) But I think coming up with the third is quite subtle.

When I watch Jeopardy! at home, I tend to better in geography categories than I do in other categories. I'm pretty sure, without looking at a map, that countries bordering Ecuador are Colombia (to the north/northeast) and Peru (to the south/southeast). But I think it's a little tricky to expect people to know whether the equator intersects Colombia or Peru or both.

Looking on Google maps just now, I see that the equator passes through Colombia and not Peru. However, it's a fairly small percentage of Colombia's area that's south of the equator. Furthermore, Peru's northernmost point is extremely close to the equator. (More Googling reveals that Peru's northernmost point is located at 0 degrees, 1 minute, 48 seconds south of the equator.)

I think asking for 2 of the 3 countries would have made more sense.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Paucle »

skullturf wrote:And of course, there was other information in the question, such as the exact years that the country was a dictatorship.
True, but wasn't it essentially a geography category? And that part of the clue is history. If I call for a clue based on my strength in the category, I'd feel cheated if some of the help to get it right was in a completely different category. If I wanted category "H," I would've selected it instead of "G."
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by TryphonTournesol »

skullturf wrote:I remember another geography question from the archives, from 2005, that I thought was surprisingly subtle. (EDIT: To be fair, I just noticed that this was in the Ultimate Tournament of Champions.) It's from this game and it was an $800 clue in the J! round (also a DD). The clue was:

"They're the 3 South American countries through which the equator passes."

I think naming 2 of those countries is relatively easy for trivia buffs. (One country is very large, and one country's name is a huge hint.) But I think coming up with the third is quite subtle.

When I watch Jeopardy! at home, I tend to better in geography categories than I do in other categories. I'm pretty sure, without looking at a map, that countries bordering Ecuador are Colombia (to the north/northeast) and Peru (to the south/southeast). But I think it's a little tricky to expect people to know whether the equator intersects Colombia or Peru or both.

Looking on Google maps just now, I see that the equator passes through Colombia and not Peru. However, it's a fairly small percentage of Colombia's area that's south of the equator. Furthermore, Peru's northernmost point is extremely close to the equator. (More Googling reveals that Peru's northernmost point is located at 0 degrees, 1 minute, 48 seconds south of the equator.)

I think asking for 2 of the 3 countries would have made more sense.
I'm a huge geography guy, but that's a really hard question, particularly in the sense that it seems tailor-made to get wrong. I almost certainly would have negged with Brazil, Ecuador and Peru. Looking at a map I can see that Ecuador borders more of Colombia than I always think it does, but as you rightly say, where the equator falls in Colombia and where Peru is are very close. It's a distinction so subtle that, really, it means the question is primarily set up to reward people who have done list memorization of something like "every country through which the equator passes," since even if you're like me and can generally get a pretty good map in your head of the relative position of countries, your head map is no doubt not calibrated finely enough to catch distinctions like that. That's kind of lame, IMO.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

TenPoundHammer wrote:What can I say? I gave up after Goblet of Fire. Wasn't getting anything out of it.
Pffftt! Muggle.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by bpmod »

Sherm wrote:
bpmod wrote:
ComingUpMilhouse wrote:They also do that standing upright behavior a lot, if you've ever seen them at a zoo.
And, of course, it follows, that if you haven't seen one at a zoo, they don't. :mrgreen:

Sorry, Sara. Couldn't resist.

Brian
OK, this is some of that tree falling forest crap, and I never hear one of those things. It ticks me off, because I'm never right.
:?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

Brian
...but the senator, while insisting he was not intoxicated, could not explain his nudity.

If I had 50 cents for every math question I got right, I'd have $6.30 by now.
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

ComingUpMilhouse wrote:I want to say rooks showed up in the Redwall books from time to time as well, if we want to get even nerdier with this.
Of COURSE we want to. That's who we are. Talk nerdy to us, baby!

Um. Did I type that out loud? :oops:
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Re: Tuesday, March 5, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

seaborgium wrote:Here's how it works out (I know I'm preaching to the choir in your case, opus, but I'm just putting it out here):
We'll call first place's pre-FJ score f and second place's s.
If first place offers a tie to second, first's wager is 2s - f.
So if first is wrong, his score will be f - (2s - f) = 2f - 2s = 2(f - s), i.e. double first's pre-FJ lead.
If second is above 2f - 2s, it's a decent bet to try and remain above that. So the wager to do that is s - (2f - 2s) = s - 2f + 2s = 3s - 2f. There you go!
And to think people say studying algebra is a waste of time because they'll never need it.
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