Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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This Is Kirk!
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! »

BigDaddyMatty wrote:
morbeedo wrote:Why was Glacier Bay accepted for national park? Anyone else neg on Glacier National Park?
I didn't realize I had until you brought it up. I assumed they were one and the same. Guess I need to amend my Coryat.
Glacier's the park in Montana. Glacier Bay is in Alaska. The body of water with an iceberg floating in it was the tip-off the stamp was depicting the latter.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by davey »

This Is Kirk! wrote:
BigDaddyMatty wrote:
morbeedo wrote:Why was Glacier Bay accepted for national park? Anyone else neg on Glacier National Park?
I didn't realize I had until you brought it up. I assumed they were one and the same. Guess I need to amend my Coryat.
Glacier's the park in Montana. Glacier Bay is in Alaska. The body of water with an iceberg floating in it was the tip-off the stamp was depicting the latter.
There are no bodies of water in the Montana park? I got caught by this one too. Wasn't familiar withe Glacier Bay.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Leander »

davey wrote:
This Is Kirk! wrote:
BigDaddyMatty wrote:
morbeedo wrote:Why was Glacier Bay accepted for national park? Anyone else neg on Glacier National Park?
I didn't realize I had until you brought it up. I assumed they were one and the same. Guess I need to amend my Coryat.
Glacier's the park in Montana. Glacier Bay is in Alaska. The body of water with an iceberg floating in it was the tip-off the stamp was depicting the latter.
There are no bodies of water in the Montana park? I got caught by this one too. Wasn't familiar withe Glacier Bay.
There are lakes in Glacier National Park, but they don't have icebergs floating in them.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by nlw44 »

Category 13 wrote:
MarkBarrett wrote:Kate had no luck solving the gettable (if one is old enough) Lonesome Dove or Alabama on her DDs
I don't recall what round the Georgia Songs category was in, but if Devil Went Down to Georgia was in one of the clues it would have been the second game in a row to feature a clue directly related to one of the contestant's interviews.
I'm positive Alex does this deliberately - bringing up something in the interview that he knows is going to be on the board later on - in order to level the playing field a bit for all of the contestants. He's done it plenty of times in the past, and it seems to me that by doing so, he puts it in the mind of the other two contestants as well as the one telling the story. He certainly knows the clues before the game is played, and it just seems impossible that it is not done for some purpose.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by goatman »

Instaget FJ, 43R. Knew Mind right away (they clued on it recently also!) and Nash game theory from watched the film AND study statistics. And yes, the Econ 'Nobel' is honorary, w/e.

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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by seaborgium »

Volante wrote:
seaborgium wrote:
econgator wrote:As someone mentioned his death in an auto accident a while ago, check out the article title:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/joh ... sh-n363901
Notice it doesn't say "title subject."
It does say 'subject of title' though, and given "i of j", "j i" usually (if memory serves) means the same thing.
Huh?
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Volante »

seaborgium wrote:
Volante wrote:
seaborgium wrote:
econgator wrote:As someone mentioned his death in an auto accident a while ago, check out the article title:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/joh ... sh-n363901
Notice it doesn't say "title subject."
It does say 'subject of title' though, and given "i of j", "j i" usually (if memory serves) means the same thing.
Huh?
In the article, where they use normal English. Not the URL.
John Nash, winner of the Nobel prize in economics and the subject of the movie "A Beautiful Mind," was killed with his wife Saturday in a car crash in New Jersey, according to state police.
...winner of the Nobel prize in economics and the subject of the movie "A Beautiful Mind"...
...Nobel prize in economics winner and "A Beautiful Mind" subject...
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by seaborgium »

Volante wrote:
seaborgium wrote:
Volante wrote:
seaborgium wrote:
econgator wrote:As someone mentioned his death in an auto accident a while ago, check out the article title:

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/joh ... sh-n363901
Notice it doesn't say "title subject."
It does say 'subject of title' though, and given "i of j", "j i" usually (if memory serves) means the same thing.
Huh?
In the article, where they use normal English. Not the URL.
John Nash, winner of the Nobel prize in economics and the subject of the movie "A Beautiful Mind," was killed with his wife Saturday in a car crash in New Jersey, according to state police.
...winner of the Nobel prize in economics and the subject of the movie "A Beautiful Mind"...
...Nobel prize in economics winner and "A Beautiful Mind" subject...
The URL wasn't the point, it was the text search on the right, indicating "subject of title" (that's normal English?) is nowhere in the article (which your quotation further shows).
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

goforthetie wrote:The thought of Patton winning a Nobel is hilarious.
Right? Might as well give one to Henry Kissinger.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by mjgX »

davey wrote:
jwatcher16 wrote:
teapot37 wrote:Some would argue this FJ has no correct answers. The "Nobel Prize in Economics" isn't, technically, a Nobel Prize.

Didn't keep me from saying Nash.
Hi there -

The Nobel Prize in Econ isn't a Nobel Prize??? How is that? I know there's no Nobel in Math... but????
[/i]
The economics prize wasn't endowed by Nobel, but it's named in his memory and listed and discussed at the Nobel Prize official website along with all the others.
Yes, it may be named in his memory, but it is not a Nobel.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by John Boy »

jeff6286 wrote:
Golf wrote:
Some would argue this FJ has no correct answers. The "Nobel Prize in Economics" isn't, technically, a Nobel Prize.
This is correct. The official name is the " Swedish National Bank's Prize In Economic Sciences In Memory Of Alfred Nobel." It's awarding in the Nobel ceremony is controversial, as economics cannot be termed a science in the same way chemistry or biology is, since it is not subject to peer reviewed journals.

And don't get me started on the "title subject" part. This FJ should be taken out and shot.
There are several posters in this thread who are being argumentative just for sake of doing so. The Nobel Prize discussion as it pertains to a Jeopardy clue is silly and detracts from what was a straightforward FJ.

Oscars is standard Jeopardy fare that should be studied by all contestants before taping, but as we know very few actually do.
Knowing whether Nash or Gandhi won the prize or knowing if the films about them won Best Picture, absolutely that is fair game, and I don't think anyone is arguing that it isn't. The point about the Economic Prize not being a true Nobel Prize, I guess that's an interesting fact, though i don't think anyone is strenuously arguing that it breaks this clue.

I do think this clue had one major flaw, the choice of the words "title subject". I think it would be very plausible for someone to, in parsing this clue in 30 seconds, to be able to think "I know A Beautiful Mind won Best Picture, and I know John Nash won the Nobel for Economics, but is that the answer they're looking for? Is the title subject John Nash, or is it his mind? Did his mind win the Nobel Prize? I suppose in a sense it did, as his mind did the work that was honored, but no prize has ever been engraved with "The Mind of ______" on it, I presume. Maybe they just didn't think of Nash when they wrote this. I bet the answer is someone else...did Gandhi win the Nobel Peace Prize? I know the film won Best Picture. I'm at 24 seconds so I don't have much more time to think about this, I'm gonna guess that Gandhi is the answer they want, I sure don't want to answer Nash and get ruled wrong on a technicality.

Try the clue again without the word "title": The only Nobel Prize winner to be the subject of a Best Picture Oscar winner is this man

Does this leave any ambiguity? Is there any Nobel Prize winner that was a part of a Best Picture winning film but not in the title? No one that I can think of. But then again, someone could have had some small mention or reference. Maybe this is better: The only Nobel Prize winner to be the main subject of a Best Picture Oscar winner is this man

This tells us we're not necessarily looking for someone named in the title. So something like The King's Speech or A Man for All Seasons or A Beautiful Mind should be fair game, if any of them were about a Nobel winner. I think the writers failed a bit on this one. There should never be a time in processing an FJ clue that you think of an answer that you know factually fits all the parts of the clue, you're just not sure if you're correctly reading what they want you to see as the factual parts of the clue. Certainly some could argue that of course John Nash is the title subject, it's his mind, duh, but again, I think a reasonable person could very easily be unsure about this and try to search for an alternate answer instead of going with something they're concerned might be ruled out by the clue.
Exactly what I would have said if I were articulate and knowledgeable.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by dhkendall »

mjgX wrote:
davey wrote:
jwatcher16 wrote:
teapot37 wrote:Some would argue this FJ has no correct answers. The "Nobel Prize in Economics" isn't, technically, a Nobel Prize.

Didn't keep me from saying Nash.
Hi there -

The Nobel Prize in Econ isn't a Nobel Prize??? How is that? I know there's no Nobel in Math... but????
[/i]
The economics prize wasn't endowed by Nobel, but it's named in his memory and listed and discussed at the Nobel Prize official website along with all the others.
Yes, it may be named in his memory, but it is not a Nobel.
At least, thankfully, this didn't affect the outcome of the game.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by AleBelly »

Kenny wrote:
teapot37 wrote:Some would argue this FJ has no correct answers. The "Nobel Prize in Economics" isn't, technically, a Nobel Prize.
This is correct. The official name is the " Swedish National Bank's Prize In Economic Sciences In Memory Of Alfred Nobel." It's awarding in the Nobel ceremony is controversial, as economics cannot be termed a science in the same way chemistry or biology is, since it is not subject to peer reviewed journals.

And don't get me started on the "title subject" part. This FJ should be taken out and shot.
Are you saying economics papers aren't peer-reviewed? Because this is patently untrue. And I say this as a chemist who is all too happy to cast aspersions on other sciences. ;)
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jwatcher16 »

Hi all -

I see the Nobel discussion is still "around." My own take is this, the best 'analogy' I've thought of to explain my thinking:

Those who watch crime/courtroom shows (reality-based or fictional) know that facts, even forensic facts, can be interpreted differently. One doesn't have to dispute the fact that teapot 37 and Ontario Quizzer brought out that Nobel himself didn't establish the prize. However, other considerations, such as the facts that it IS listed along with the other prizes on the Nobel site, and that it IS presented at the SAME CEREMONY as the others (even though that may be controversial), except for the Nobel Peace Prize (which happens to be Human Rights Day, good folks!) leads me to draw a different conclusion, that is IS a Nobel Prize.

And I wasn't going to do this here, but it has been bothering me and maybe I should. Just a note to Davey. I found your reply to me: "It's not just you, it's the world we live in..." just a bit dismissive and disrespectful. I'm not sure what you were meaning to say, but I felt you were lumping me into some dismissive category. I didn't appreciate that. I take pride in being an individual, and try to conduct myself with some sort of integrity. Also, in the statement you quoted, I was trying to be nice about not really agreeing with their conclusion. I hope you understand why I didn't care for that remark.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by davey »

jwatcher16 wrote:Hi all -

I see the Nobel discussion is still "around." My own take is this, the best 'analogy' I've thought of to explain my thinking:

Those who watch crime/courtroom shows (reality-based or fictional) know that facts, even forensic facts, can be interpreted differently. One doesn't have to dispute the fact that teapot 37 and Ontario Quizzer brought out that Nobel himself didn't establish the prize. However, other considerations, such as the facts that it IS listed along with the other prizes on the Nobel site, and that it IS presented at the SAME CEREMONY as the others (even though that may be controversial), except for the Nobel Peace Prize (which happens to be Human Rights Day, good folks!) leads me to draw a different conclusion, that is IS a Nobel Prize.

And I wasn't going to do this here, but it has been bothering me and maybe I should. Just a note to Davey. I found your reply to me: "It's not just you, it's the world we live in..." just a bit dismissive and disrespectful. I'm not sure what you were meaning to say, but I felt you were lumping me into some dismissive category. I didn't appreciate that. I take pride in being an individual, and try to conduct myself with some sort of integrity. Also, in the statement you quoted, I was trying to be nice about not really agreeing with their conclusion. I hope you understand why I didn't care for that remark.
You've misinterpreted. You said
I'm not sure I'd argue it's NOT a Nobel Prize
and I was agreeing (just as I agree with what you say in this post) that it's not something to argue about. In the world we live in, it's a Nobel Prize. To say it's not is to indulge in a trivia gotcha. The Nobel family disapproves of the award. The Nobel Foundation awards it.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by cthulhu »

Count me on the side of those who think the wording of FJ was dishonest. :x
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jwatcher16 »

davey wrote: You've misinterpreted. You said
I'm not sure I'd argue it's NOT a Nobel Prize
and I was agreeing (just as I agree with what you say in this post) that it's not something to argue about. In the world we live in, it's a Nobel Prize. To say it's not is to indulge in a trivia gotcha. The Nobel family disapproves of the award. The Nobel Foundation awards it.
Hi Davey -

Well, thanks for responding and clarifying. Sorry if I misinterpreted, but I'm not sure how I was to get what you just said from that one sentence! Was there perhaps another previous post I somehow overlooked? Yes, I have to agree that to most it IS indeed a Nobel. It's a shame the Nobel family disapproves.

I'm reminded of anther sort of analogy here that I thought of in thinking of this little "conundrum." If anyone used to watch The Locator with Troy Dunn (I'm a sucker for these reunion type stories), you may remember the Leonard family. This fellow was searching for his birth family. Turned out his birth father had died and the widow and the fellow's half-siblings had no idea he even existed. BUT they accepted him as one of their own. That's the way I think of this. Too bad that the Nobel family doesn't see it that way as well, that this particular prize may be a "half-sibling" but one of the family nonetheless.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Robert K S »

Just noticed a freak bug in the post-production of this game--they never added the graphic showing Mukund's 2-day total of $31,799 after Final. Alex said it aloud (and got it right), but no little subtitle thingy.
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Re: Friday, December 30, 2016 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by bpmod »

Robert K S wrote:Just noticed a freak bug in the post-production of this game--they never added the graphic showing Mukund's 2-day total of $31,799 after Final. Alex said it aloud (and got it right), but no little subtitle thingy.
I thought I noticed that when it aired and was going to go back and verify...

But I forgot.

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