TD 147: It's Elementary!

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Volante
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Volante »

Bamaman wrote:did the mythological figure have to be a mythological "person"? Would argon (named for Jason's ship) have been acceptable?
If that was its origin, I'd say yes, except I haven't found a cite that says that is the origin of the element's name...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/argon
Greek, neuter of argos idle, lazy, from a- + ergon work; from its relative inertness
First Known Use: 1894
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Bamaman »

So why did Jason name his ship the Lazy?
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Peggles »

Volante wrote:
Bamaman wrote:did the mythological figure have to be a mythological "person"? Would argon (named for Jason's ship) have been acceptable?
If that was its origin, I'd say yes, except I haven't found a cite that says that is the origin of the element's name...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/argon
Greek, neuter of argos idle, lazy, from a- + ergon work; from its relative inertness
First Known Use: 1894
Jason's ship, the Argo, was named for its builder, Argus. Argon seems to be derived from the Greek word for "inactive, " or lazy, as Volante notes.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Vanya »

Bamaman wrote:So why did Jason name his ship the Lazy?
Aergos means idle. Argos means swift.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Uncle Jeff »

Arrrgh! Curses Meitnerium! Have any of you known nearly all of the answers to all of the questions in a TD and still managed to hit sheep?

I thought sure that the sheep would be Seaborgium (locally famous) or Copernicium (recently named). I should have gone with Gadolinium, the other side of my ill-fated coin flip on that question :(
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by seaborgium »

Uncle Jeff wrote:I thought sure that the sheep would be Seaborgium (locally famous) or Copernicium (recently named).
That was my reasoning for avoiding Copernicium (btw, Woof, you omitted the second i).

I have to say I'm on fowlerism's side re the samarium ruling.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by dhkendall »

Volante wrote:
Bamaman wrote:did the mythological figure have to be a mythological "person"? Would argon (named for Jason's ship) have been acceptable?
If that was its origin, I'd say yes, except I haven't found a cite that says that is the origin of the element's name...

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/argon
Greek, neuter of argos idle, lazy, from a- + ergon work; from its relative inertness
First Known Use: 1894
Well, that definitely explains why Toronto's CFL team chose the name they did. :)
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Woof »

fowlerism wrote:
Woof wrote: Incorrect Answers - 14 points
Samarium (named indirectly for the Russian mining official Col. Vasili Samarsky-Bykhovets) - fowlerism
I have always remembered Samarsky-Bykhovets as a "mining engineer," as it says on Wikipedia, and I would argue that that an engineer is a scientist (in this case).

Here is a quote from the Wikipedia article:

"While remaining Chief of Staff, he began teaching at Saint Petersburg Mining Institute and eventually became a member of [the] scientific council there."

Is this a fair claim?
Indeed, he was trained as a mining engineer, though in his capacity as administrator he permitted the delivery of his eponymous ore to the scientists who then analyzed it. (BTW, they were most gracious in naming it for him; that is not a very common occurrence in science). Granting that he was an engineer, I still don't feel that he qualifies as a scientist. Science and engineering are distinct disciplines, as most Universities make clear in their organization. Additionally, the in vogue acronym STEM (Science, Technology, Engineering and Mathematics) also makes clear that distinction. I vacillated mightily over this issue, as your choice of Samarium was a devious and clever one, but in the end I just didn't feel that Samarsky's status as a scientist could be justified, either in his role in the discovery of the element in question, or in his training. If there's sufficient sentiment to the contrary, I'll most certainly consider a reversal of my decision.
Last edited by Woof on Tue Apr 10, 2012 2:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Woof »

fowlerism wrote:
Woof wrote:Unused Answers
Cerium (from Ceres, the Roman goddess of agriculture)
Iridium (from Iris, the Greek goddess of the rainbow)
Uranium :shock: (from Uranus the planet -- stop me when you've heard this before...)
Out of curiosity, would Palladium have been accepted? Was that what you were eluding to in the clarification of Question 1?
Yeah, I think that I would have had to accept it, as Pd is named for the asteroid Pallas, which in turn is named for Pallas Athena. Despite Pallas being an epithet of Athena, it is also the name of a Titan, so I don't see how I could have negged it in good conscience.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Woof »

3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
The final of the nomenclature questions, but how many participants recognized that this question had the most correct answers to choose from? AP, master of the arcane, once more scores a singleton with an obscure answer.

Francium (named for France by Pierre and Marie Curie) - 5
amorris525
crazymatt1
jeff6286
Peggles
TheSpiceWeasel

Americium (named for America by Glenn Seaborg) - 4
DadofTwins
Magna
Uncle Jeff
Volante

Californium (named for California by Glenn Seaborg) - 3
Bamaman
BigDaddyJ
econgator

Terbium (named for Ytterby, Sweden, the source of the mineral yttria that yielded this element, among others) - 3
boson
seaborgium
TreehugginCowgirl

Ytterbium (see above) - 3
ChemTeacher
earendel
Turd Ferguson

Berkeleium (named for Berkeley, CA by Glenn Seaborg) - 2
Aggron
Doug527

Darmstadtium (named for Darmstadt, DE by a group at GSI) - 2
immaf
jpahk

Erbium (see Terbium) - 2
Bob78164
fowlerism

Germanium (named for Germany by Clemens Winkler in Freiburg) - 2
Creed Bratton
Vanya

Dubnium (named for Dubna, Russia by researchers at the Joint Institute for Nuclear Research) - 1
goforthetie

Europium (named for Europe by Demarçay) - 1
gamawire

Gallium (named for Gallia, the Latin name for France, by Locoq de Boisbaudran) - 1
soxfan99

Hafnium (named for Hafnia, the Latin name for Copenhagen, by Coster and von Hevesy) - 1
Austin Powers

Hassium (named for Hassia, the Latin name for the German state of Hesse, by researchers at GSI) - 1
xxaaaxx

Lawrencium (named for E.O. Lawrence and discovered at Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory) - 1
bomtr

Scandium (named for Scandia, the Latin name for Scandinavia, by Nilson) -1
dhkendall

Yttrium (see Terbium) - 1
Paucle

DROP - 0
debramc

Unused Answers
Holmium (named for Stockholm, SE)
Lutetium (named for the Latin name for Paris, Lutetia)
Ruthenium (named for Ruthenia, the Latin name for Rus, a region that corresponds to parts of Belarus, Ukraine and Western Russia)

Incorrect Answers - 10
Inadeepdarkmine :D - tagNV
Rhenium (named for the Rhine river by researchers in Germany) - Randy G

Scores After Round 3
Creed Bratton 5
Austin Powers 6
Bamaman 7
ChemTeacher 7
Paucle 7
dhkendall 8
gamawire 8
soxfan99 8
Vanya 8
amorris525 9
BigDaddyJ 9
bomtr 10
crazymatt1 10
DadofTwins 10
jeff6286 10
Peggles 10
Turd Ferguson 10
Volante 10
Bob78164 11
debramc 11
Magna 12
xxaaaxx 12
goforthetie 13
boson 14
seaborgium 14
Aggron 15
Doug527 15
earendel 15
immaf 15
jpahk 15
TreehugginCowgirl 15
econgator 16
TheSpiceWeasel 16
Uncle Jeff 16
RandyG 18
fowlerism 20
tagNV 34
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Woof »

4. Name an element that is gaseous at room temperature and one atmosphere of pressure.
The answers to this question were among the least challenging IMO so, as expected, there was only one "incorrect" response. The lighter elements and Noble gases provide all the answers, so it comes down to gamesmanship and psychology. A surprising sheep and a shocking unused answer await.

Chlorine - 6
crazymatt1
DadofTwins
econgator
jeff6286
seaborgium
TheSpiceWeasel

Argon - 5
BigDaddyJ
ChemTeacher
Doug527
Peggles
Volante

Fluorine - 5
Aggron
Austin Powers
immaf
Magna
RandyG

Helium - 5
amorris525
Creed Bratton
fowlerism
gamawire
jpahk

Xenon - 4
dhkendall
earendel
TreehugginCowgirl
xxaaaxx

Krypton - 2
goforthetie
Uncle Jeff

Neon - 2
Bob78164
Turd Ferguson

Oxygen - 2
Bamaman
Vanya

Radon - 2
Paucle
soxfan99

Nitrogen - 1
debramc

DROP - 0
bomtr
boson

Unused Answers
Hydrogen :shock:

Incorrect Answers - 11
Flatuline - tagNV

Scores After Round 4
Bamaman 9
Paucle 9
bomtr 10
Creed Bratton 10
soxfan99 10
Vanya 10
Austin Powers 11
ChemTeacher 12
debramc 12
dhkendall 12
Turd Ferguson 12
Bob78164 13
gamawire 13
amorris525 14
BigDaddyJ 14
boson 14
goforthetie 15
Peggles 15
Volante 15
crazymatt1 16
DadofTwins 16
jeff6286 16
xxaaaxx 16
Magna 17
Uncle Jeff 18
earendel 19
TreehugginCowgirl 19
Aggron 20
Doug527 20
immaf 20
jpahk 20
seaborgium 20
econgator 22
TheSpiceWeasel 22
RandyG 23
fowlerism 25
tagNV 45
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by dhkendall »

Woof wrote:3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
It's a good thing my instinct to avoid anything named for Ytterby paid off! (Well, sort of, I suppose Ytterby is in Scandinavia, but I was just thinking of steering clear of Yttrium/Erbium/Terbium/Ytterbium
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Paucle »

dhkendall wrote:It's a good thing my instinct to avoid anything named for Ytterby paid off!
Conversely, I won the Ytterby lottery! :mrgreen:
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by fowlerism »

Woof wrote:I just didn't feel that Samarsky's status as a scientist could be justified, either in his role in the discovery of the element in question, or in his training. If there's sufficient sentiment to the contrary, I'll most certainly consider a reversal of my decision.
Thanks for a well-thought-out response. Onward!
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by RandyG »

Woof wrote:3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
..
Incorrect Answers - 10
Rhenium (named for the Rhine river by researchers in Germany) - Randy G
Yes, exactly.... and the Rhine doesn't describe a place of discovery? I could understand if the researchers were in Mongolia and Rhenium was named to honor their fond memories of childhood, but they were in Germany.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Vanya »

RandyG wrote:
Woof wrote:3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
..
Incorrect Answers - 10
Rhenium (named for the Rhine river by researchers in Germany) - Randy G
Yes, exactly.... and the Rhine doesn't describe a place of discovery? I could understand if the researchers were in Mongolia and Rhenium was named to honor their fond memories of childhood, but they were in Germany.
Americium is suspect as well. It wasn't named for its place of discovery, but that it's below Europium on the table.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by goforthetie »

RandyG wrote:
Woof wrote:3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
..
Incorrect Answers - 10
Rhenium (named for the Rhine river by researchers in Germany) - Randy G
Yes, exactly.... and the Rhine doesn't describe a place of discovery? I could understand if the researchers were in Mongolia and Rhenium was named to honor their fond memories of childhood, but they were in Germany.
What province? If they were in the Rhineland, I'd give it to you. If they were in Prussia, probably not.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by fowlerism »

I thought about putting thulium for Question 3, but I didn't have the guts. I don't think it would be wrong.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by Bamaman »

After four questions, I am in first place in a TD about the elements and I still haven't dropped one yet?

That can't be right. I demand a recount.
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Re: TD 147: It's Elementary!

Post by RandyG »

goforthetie wrote:
RandyG wrote:
Woof wrote:3. Supply the name of an element that was named for its place of discovery.
..
Incorrect Answers - 10
Rhenium (named for the Rhine river by researchers in Germany) - Randy G
Yes, exactly.... and the Rhine doesn't describe a place of discovery? I could understand if the researchers were in Mongolia and Rhenium was named to honor their fond memories of childhood, but they were in Germany.
What province? If they were in the Rhineland, I'd give it to you. If they were in Prussia, probably not.
Germany is about as precise as it gets in a quick scan of the literature. I'll just kick it back to Woof to determine whether my answer lies within the spirit of the question.
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