Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]
Moderators: alietr, trainman, econgator, dhkendall
- Wimple
- Jeopardy! Fan
- Posts: 62
- Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2011 2:05 pm
- Location: So Cal
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
Les Paul is being featured on the local (LA) news tonight. I guess his guitar collection is being auctioned off or something.
- jpahk
- Jeopardy! TOCer
- Posts: 615
- Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:16 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
i knew "ordinate" would be a triple-stumper—definitely undervalued at $800. (i was expecting "abscissa" when i got the $2000 DD in "A" in math.) but when they didn't go in for "quadratic" at $2000, i laughed. that category was just a mess.
but yeah, this was Another Joel Game (TM). played well, not great, and single-got FJ. congrats to him.
but yeah, this was Another Joel Game (TM). played well, not great, and single-got FJ. congrats to him.
- alietr
- Site Admin
- Posts: 8978
- Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:20 pm
- Location: Bethesda, MD
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
I will embarrassingly admit that I wasn't thinking "quadratic" but said "parabola" instead. Judges?
- econgator
- Let's Go Mets!
- Posts: 10671
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:32 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
No. A parabola is y=ax2+bx+c and y cannot be made equal 0.alietr wrote:I will embarrassingly admit that I wasn't thinking "quadratic" but said "parabola" instead. Judges?
- Volante
- Harbinger of the Doomed Lemur
- Posts: 9254
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:42 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
Sure it can! If x^2 = y, and x=0,then y = 0. A parabolic function is just the quadratic without constraining it to one (or two) solution(s).econgator wrote:No. A parabola is y=ax2+bx+c and y cannot be made equal 0.alietr wrote:I will embarrassingly admit that I wasn't thinking "quadratic" but said "parabola" instead. Judges?
The clue explicitly set y to 0, though, and that's the quadratic. Can't make a parabola with (at most) two points.
The best thing that Neil Armstrong ever did, was to let us all imagine we were him.
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
- OrangeSAM
- (Unranked)
- Posts: 2161
- Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 9:00 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
This thread is bordering on unreal.Volante wrote:Sure it can! If x^2 = y, and x=0,then y = 0. A parabolic function is just the quadratic without constraining it to one (or two) solution(s).econgator wrote:No. A parabola is y=ax2+bx+c and y cannot be made equal 0.alietr wrote:I will embarrassingly admit that I wasn't thinking "quadratic" but said "parabola" instead. Judges?
The clue explicitly set y to 0, though, and that's the quadratic. Can't make a parabola with (at most) two points.
OCSam
- econgator
- Let's Go Mets!
- Posts: 10671
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:32 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
But if x=0, then it's just a linear function, no?Volante wrote:Sure it can! If x^2 = y, and x=0,then y = 0. A parabolic function is just the quadratic without constraining it to one (or two) solution(s).
- Volante
- Harbinger of the Doomed Lemur
- Posts: 9254
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:42 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
No, because where x = 2 or -2, y = 4.econgator wrote:But if x=0, then it's just a linear function, no?Volante wrote:Sure it can! If x^2 = y, and x=0,then y = 0. A parabolic function is just the quadratic without constraining it to one (or two) solution(s).
(I tried putting a link to wolfram alpha here, but it's a finicky little twerp... )
A linear function I guess would be y = mx+b?
The best thing that Neil Armstrong ever did, was to let us all imagine we were him.
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
-
- The support is non-zero
- Posts: 2727
- Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2011 12:10 pm
- Contact:
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
If I were a judge, I would allow it (close enough for Jeopardy mathematics/science standards). In a major brain malfunction I said quadrilateral.alietr wrote:I will embarrassingly admit that I wasn't thinking "quadratic" but said "parabola" instead. Judges?
- econgator
- Let's Go Mets!
- Posts: 10671
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:32 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
But if x= +/- 2, then it doesn't equal 0, like I said it did.Volante wrote:No, because where x = 2 or -2, y = 4.econgator wrote:But if x=0, then it's just a linear function, no?Volante wrote:Sure it can! If x^2 = y, and x=0,then y = 0. A parabolic function is just the quadratic without constraining it to one (or two) solution(s).
(I tried putting a link to wolfram alpha here, but it's a finicky little twerp... )
A linear function I guess would be y = mx+b?
If x=0, then y=bx+c, which is linear.
-
- Best Self-Destruct Button
- Posts: 205
- Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2012 10:55 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
I loved the Double Jeopardy board today. And since Alex corrects everyone on their pronunciation. At least where I come from, Alex, it's pronounced BOW-lynn, not BOW-line
- Woof
- Swimming in the Jeopardy! Pool
- Posts: 5125
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:53 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
???? If x=0, you're evaluating the function at x=0 and what you've got is no longer a function. A quadratic at x=0 evaluates to y=c where c is the y-intercept (duh!). A parabola is a particular subset of quadratic equation where b=0 (i.e., y=ax^2 + c). As the clue explicitly laid out the equation as ax^2 + bx + c = 0, parabola would not be a correct answer.econgator wrote:But if x= +/- 2, then it doesn't equal 0, like I said it did.Volante wrote:No, because where x = 2 or -2, y = 4.econgator wrote:
But if x=0, then it's just a linear function, no?
(I tried putting a link to wolfram alpha here, but it's a finicky little twerp... )
A linear function I guess would be y = mx+b?
If x=0, then y=bx+c, which is linear.
-
- Undefeated in Reruns
- Posts: 8937
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:31 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
y = ax^2 + bx + c (for nonzero values of a) is a parabola. x = 0 is just one point on that parabola (x being a variable means that we look at more than one value of it). You might as well be saying that if x = 2, then y = bx + c + 4a, which, with c and a as constants, is linear. Once you have a value for x, you follow it through until you have a value for y. If x = 0, y = c, and you've got an ordered pair, a point on the graph where the equation is true, not a line.econgator wrote:But if x= +/- 2, then it doesn't equal 0, like I said it did.Volante wrote:No, because where x = 2 or -2, y = 4.econgator wrote: But if x=0, then it's just a linear function, no?
(I tried putting a link to wolfram alpha here, but it's a finicky little twerp... )
A linear function I guess would be y = mx+b?
If x=0, then y=bx+c, which is linear.
In short, no.
- Volante
- Harbinger of the Doomed Lemur
- Posts: 9254
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 11:42 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
ax^2 + bx + c = 0 where a != 0 and b != 0 is also a parabola, it just moves the vertex off the y-axis.Woof wrote:???? If x=0, you're evaluating the function at x=0 and what you've got is no longer a function. A quadratic at x=0 evaluates to y=c where c is the y-intercept (duh!). A parabola is a particular subset of quadratic equation where b=0 (i.e., y=ax^2 + c). As the clue explicitly laid out the equation as ax^2 + bx + c = 0, parabola would not be a correct answer.econgator wrote:But if x= +/- 2, then it doesn't equal 0, like I said it did.Volante wrote: No, because where x = 2 or -2, y = 4.
(I tried putting a link to wolfram alpha here, but it's a finicky little twerp... )
A linear function I guess would be y = mx+b?
If x=0, then y=bx+c, which is linear.
The best thing that Neil Armstrong ever did, was to let us all imagine we were him.
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
Latest movies (1-10): Everything Everywhere All at Once (10), Ruby Gillman: Teenage Kraken (6), Black Sunday /1960/ (6), Marcel the Shell with Shoes On (7)
- Woof
- Swimming in the Jeopardy! Pool
- Posts: 5125
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:53 pm
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
Yes, correct you are. b!=0 removes the symmetry about the y-axis.Volante wrote: ax^2 + bx + c = 0 where a != 0 and b != 0 is also a parabola, it just moves the vertex off the y-axis.
- dhkendall
- Pursuing the Dream
- Posts: 8789
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:49 am
- Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
- Contact:
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
I just want to say that I am no good in algebra (came within one point on my grade 12 final algebra exam of failing it, and with it, high school), but just seeing this conversation going on makes me realize why I love this board so much (the sheer intellectual quality of the posts).
Carry on, fellow nerds. Carry on.
Carry on, fellow nerds. Carry on.
"Jeopardy! is two parts luck and one part luck" - Me
"The way to win on Jeopardy is to be a rabidly curious, information-omnivorous person your entire life." - Ken Jennings
Follow my progress game by game since 2012
"The way to win on Jeopardy is to be a rabidly curious, information-omnivorous person your entire life." - Ken Jennings
Follow my progress game by game since 2012
- jpahk
- Jeopardy! TOCer
- Posts: 615
- Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2011 1:16 am
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
odd. i'm just fine in algebra, and i've had the exact opposite reaction—just shaking my head sadly at most of this and hoping it would stop. (seaborgium has got it right, unsurprisingly, but almost everything posted both before and after has been wrong.) since i haven't seen it summed up quite succinctly enough for people to get it, here is my one and only contribution:dhkendall wrote:I just want to say that I am no good in algebra (came within one point on my grade 12 final algebra exam of failing it, and with it, high school), but just seeing this conversation going on makes me realize why I love this board so much (the sheer intellectual quality of the posts).
Carry on, fellow nerds. Carry on.
y = ax^2+bx+c is an equation that expresses a relationship between two variables, x and y. you can plot it on a cartesian graph and (for nonzero a) you would get a parabola. it is a quadratic equation, because it expresses a quadratic relationship between y and x. but it is also true that this is the equation of a parabola. if the clue had asked about what kind of equation this is, "parabolic" would be acceptable.
ax^2+bx+c = 0 (the equation in the clue) is an equation with a single variable, x. you cannot plot it on a cartesian graph. you can solve it for x; there are 0, 1, or 2 real solutions, depending on the values of a, b, and c. this is a quadratic equation, but there is no parabola here. so "parabolic" cannot be a correct answer to the clue on the show.
- dhkendall
- Pursuing the Dream
- Posts: 8789
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 11:49 am
- Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
- Contact:
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
But you, see, Joon, that's why I love the thread. It's the simple fact that people are debating algebraic equations. You ain't gonna see that on Free Republic or reddit.jpahk wrote:odd. i'm just fine in algebra, and i've had the exact opposite reaction—just shaking my head sadly at most of this and hoping it would stop. (seaborgium has got it right, unsurprisingly, but almost everything posted both before and after has been wrong.) since i haven't seen it summed up quite succinctly enough for people to get it, here is my one and only contribution:dhkendall wrote:I just want to say that I am no good in algebra (came within one point on my grade 12 final algebra exam of failing it, and with it, high school), but just seeing this conversation going on makes me realize why I love this board so much (the sheer intellectual quality of the posts).
Carry on, fellow nerds. Carry on.
y = ax^2+bx+c is an equation that expresses a relationship between two variables, x and y. you can plot it on a cartesian graph and (for nonzero a) you would get a parabola. it is a quadratic equation, because it expresses a quadratic relationship between y and x. but it is also true that this is the equation of a parabola. if the clue had asked about what kind of equation this is, "parabolic" would be acceptable.
ax^2+bx+c = 0 (the equation in the clue) is an equation with a single variable, x. you cannot plot it on a cartesian graph. you can solve it for x; there are 0, 1, or 2 real solutions, depending on the values of a, b, and c. this is a quadratic equation, but there is no parabola here. so "parabolic" cannot be a correct answer to the clue on the show.
"Jeopardy! is two parts luck and one part luck" - Me
"The way to win on Jeopardy is to be a rabidly curious, information-omnivorous person your entire life." - Ken Jennings
Follow my progress game by game since 2012
"The way to win on Jeopardy is to be a rabidly curious, information-omnivorous person your entire life." - Ken Jennings
Follow my progress game by game since 2012
- alietr
- Site Admin
- Posts: 8978
- Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:20 pm
- Location: Bethesda, MD
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
Aw, crap, Joon. I preferred when I had a chance at being right.jpahk wrote:this is a quadratic equation, but there is no parabola here. so "parabolic" cannot be a correct answer to the clue on the show.
- Paucle
- Trekardy! Writer
- Posts: 3233
- Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 3:36 pm
- Location: near Albany NY
Re: Monday, May 28, 2012 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)
Over there, it only looks like that's what's going on. (No! U=r 2b a loosr!)dhkendall wrote:But you, see, Joon, that's why I love the thread. It's the simple fact that people are debating algebraic equations. You ain't gonna see that on Free Republic or reddit.