Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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kickerofelves
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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by kickerofelves »

Patronaut wrote:
kickerofelves wrote:Just freshman physics... and physical chemistry, which is almost physics. ;)

And mmmm, 'O' Fries. My nostalgic trashy Oakland food of youth is the $3.99 pizzas from Antoon's.
Who was your professor for freshman physics?

I also spent a lot of time at Hemingway's and Peter's Pub.
I had the late (I just learned) Doc Stewart.

And Hemingway's was a definite hangout, once I was of age...

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by alietr »

svocan wrote:I did two years at CMU, until I joined the world's swelling ranks of architecture school dropouts. This is why you may have noticed a smile from me during my daily double on Friday. :-)
I did two years at CMU also, but I got a degree out of it.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Patronaut »

kickerofelves wrote:
Patronaut wrote:
kickerofelves wrote:Just freshman physics... and physical chemistry, which is almost physics. ;)

And mmmm, 'O' Fries. My nostalgic trashy Oakland food of youth is the $3.99 pizzas from Antoon's.
Who was your professor for freshman physics?

I also spent a lot of time at Hemingway's and Peter's Pub.
I had the late (I just learned) Doc Stewart.

And Hemingway's was a definite hangout, once I was of age...
Then I never taught you. I only taught physics my first year. I taught astronomy exclusively after that. Well, we were grad students, so we needed to drink.
"Physics is to mathematics as sex is to masturbation." - Richard Feynman.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by alietr »

You must have hung out with Dr. Jay Apt then?

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by skullturf »

Did anyone do what I did, and figured out "Pioneer Day" on the spot without previously knowing it?

I just figured that with a word like "pioneer", it would probably be a religion that started in the English-speaking world and probably in North America. Mormonism it is.

The other one I figured out without literally "knowing" it was the East Germany one. German name + communist = East Germany, I thought.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Patronaut »

skullturf wrote:Did anyone do what I did, and figured out "Pioneer Day" on the spot without previously knowing it?

I just figured that with a word like "pioneer", it would probably be a religion that started in the English-speaking world and probably in North America. Mormonism it is.

The other one I figured out without literally "knowing" it was the East Germany one. German name + communist = East Germany, I thought.
I knew Pioneer Day was a Mormon day right away. For Shrove Tuesday, I immediately thought "Catholic".
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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by skullturf »

bpmod wrote: So, by that argument, Christianity = Judaism.

Brian
That's different, because Christians generally don't consider themselves to be Jews. By contrast, as far as I'm aware, Mormons generally consider themselves to be Christian.

I think in situations like this, one should go by how the members of the religion describe themselves.

The way I see it, there are essentially two options. Either you go with how the members of the religion describe themselves, or you attempt to go with a more "objective" description of how the religion "really" should be classified. But that's opening a gigantic can of worms.

I don't think a game show should have any official opinion on whether or not Mormons are "really" Christians, beyond just going with how Mormons describe themselves, for the purposes of clue-writing.

Similarly, I don't think a game show should have an official opinion on whether Catholics are "truer" Christians than Lutherans, or vice versa. I don't think a game show should have an official opinion on whose religious beliefs are more correct.

I think it makes sense, for ease of exposition, for a clue about Judaism to be phrased based on what Jews believe, and for a clue about Islam to be phrased based on what Muslims believe, and so on, without the show necessarily either endorsing or denying that particular religious belief.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by MarkBarrett »

Should the FJ clue summary post on page one and the archive page when it's done have something to note Alex's French accent for reading part of the clue? It seems like some guessed Cubism off the clue, but if they had heard the French they may have been steered away.

Alex should have read the clue straight. It seems like it is a case where playing the clue off a transcript/archive/post is not the same as it was for viewer/listeners.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

MarkBarrett wrote:Salvo got the lockpeat. On a quick look I'm only seeing Leach, Jass and Shore for doing that in the previous TOC field in their regular games. For the 2011 field it was 5/15 who did it. For the threelockpeat it's Stephanie Jass and Joon Pahk who did not make the TOC finals.
Joon made the finals. They just had them a little early that year. :)

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Fleeboy »

"Lockpeat"

That's a new one, Mark. I'll file that one away.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

stevo4212 wrote:WTF with Final Jeopardy, Well, I guess they say if it sounds too good to be true, it is too good to be true.

Isn't Mormonism a Christian religion? Why does Jeopardy get away with that nonsense? unique religion X 4 then Mormonism.
It depends who you ask. Mormonism does not meet the classic definition of Christianity as set forth in 325 A.D. by the Council of Nicaea. The Nicene Creed has been a fixture in Christian churches and a benchmark for what constitutes the essential Christian confession of faith. East may have divided from West since then. The Protestants may have attempted a Reformation and splintered into a million groups instead. But they have all always agreed on The Nicene Creed.

There have been quibbles around a few edges of the Creed (e.g. the filioque debate) and skirmishes over how it should be interpreted. But at the core of the Nicene Creed is the Trinity. The Council met to nail down that precise doctrine and to do it precisely. At that point, the Church defined groups that believe what the Mormons believe as non-Christian. Other modern groups that wouldn't make the cut are the Jehovah's Witnesses, the Christian Scientists, and the Unitarians.

I think the writers generally treat Mormonism/LDS as a specific religion without specifically implying that it is non-Christian. The Shrove Tuesday clue really bollixed things up in this respect. "Christianity" was the accepted answer there despite applying only to a large minority subset of Christians. That made it clear that the correct response for "Pioneer Day" had to be something other than "Christianity."

Compare that to these two clues from the past:

#3258, aired 1998-11-04 THE MORMONS $200: Mormons consider themselves this, like about 2 billion others; Southern Baptists don't agree
#4297, aired 2003-04-15 TAKES 2 TO TONGA $400: 15% of Tonga's almost all-Christian population are of this branch usually associated with Utah

The 1998 clue doesn't take a position; it just reports the position of others. The 2003 clue unequivocally tags LDS as a "branch" of Christianity. I'd say this recent clue is out of step with that stance.

I agree that in any event, the category shouldn't have had two clues centered around the same religion. Even if one considers Mormonism a heresy, it's a Christian heresy, not a Muslim or Shinto heresy. I say dump the "Shrove Tuesday" clue and leave "Pioneer Day" in. That's the more interesting clue from a TOM perspective. If a contestant says "What is Christianity?" BMS them.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by southsidehitman »

Leander wrote:
I have no idea where they pulled that from, but I'd hardly call it how the movement was born. I know a fair amount about Impressionism, and had never heard this one. In fact, if you Google the quote (in quotes), there aren't an awful lot of references to it on the Web. Nope, this was a real stinker of a clue with very little pointing you correctly to the response. Boo, hiss. (FTR, I responded Fauvism to have something regarding color.)
Completely agree. In this case, Alex's bad French accent led me to a French movement, and then being stumped and looking at the trend of recent FJ's, I went with the simplest and most obvious, even though I couldn't see a link to the clue. And I was right.
I used Alex's quasi-French accent as a TOM, and also remembered that most artists use black as a bordering color, and the only thing I remember about the fundamentals of Impressionism is that nothing ever had a border. Whether or not this was faulty logic, I got it right (after first considering expressionism for about five seconds).

Also, I got "refrain", having been a choral conductor in a previous life, although I completely see how people might have thought "chorale/corral". Didn't Alex clarify pre-round, however, that each response was the same word with two different meanings, not just possibly similar-sounding words?
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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by silverscreentest »

opusthepenguin wrote:It depends who you ask. Mormonism does not meet the classic definition of Christianity as set forth in 325 A.D. by the Council of Nicaea. The Nicene Creed has been a fixture in Christian churches and a benchmark for what constitutes the essential Christian confession of faith. East may have divided from West since then. The Protestants may have attempted a Reformation and splintered into a million groups instead. But they have all always agreed on The Nicene Creed.

There have been quibbles around a few edges of the Creed (e.g. the filioque debate) and skirmishes over how it should be interpreted. But at the core of the Nicene Creed is the Trinity. The Council met to nail down that precise doctrine and to do it precisely. At that point, the Church defined groups that believe what the Mormons believe as non-Christian. Other modern groups that wouldn't make the cut are the Jehovah's Witnesses, the Christian Scientists, and the Unitarians.
The most esoteric premise for a board game ever: Credo, the game of the creation of the Nicene Creed.
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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

MarkBarrett wrote:Should the FJ clue summary post on page one and the archive page when it's done have something to note Alex's French accent for reading part of the clue? It seems like some guessed Cubism off the clue, but if they had heard the French they may have been steered away.
I noticed the accent. Wasn't quite sure what it was. It could've been a mixture of French and Spanish accents, which leads to Picasso just fine.


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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by opusthepenguin »

Patronaut wrote:I did not get the FJ question, nor did my wife, the one with a Master's in Art History, but I digress.

If I didn't get Panther, I would never be able to go back to my second Alma Mater, the University of Pittsburgh.
What's the down side? ;)

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by groovitude »

opusthepenguin wrote:
Patronaut wrote:I did not get the FJ question, nor did my wife, the one with a Master's in Art History, but I digress.

If I didn't get Panther, I would never be able to go back to my second Alma Mater, the University of Pittsburgh.
What's the down side? ;)
I've never been to Pittsburgh, but based on their discussion, 'O' Fries sound like quite a draw. (I may have to swap food recommendations with svocan.)

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by fowlerism »

Der Blaue Reiter here. I stuck with it, even when my wife said her guess of Impressionism. I'm proud of this miss.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by harrumph »

This FJ was badly conceived, if you are knowledgeable about art then you were less likely to get it as a WAG with the first art movement that comes to mind was the way to go. I went with Fauvism as it is more specifically about color and is associated with the Frenchman Matisse. Impressionism is defined by a whole bunch of things and color choice is down the list.

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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by TenPoundHammer »

silverscreentest wrote:The most esoteric premise for a board game ever: Credo, the game of the creation of the Nicene Creed.
At least it's not the Athanasian Creed. How many times does that thing say "There are not three ___s, but one ____" again? I lost count after 46.
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Re: Monday, April 8, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Magna »

silverscreentest wrote:The most esoteric premise for a board game ever: Credo, the game of the creation of the Nicene Creed.
I thought you were joking, until I followed the link!

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