Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Archivists » Wed May 29, 2013 11:30 am

Game Recap for Show #6618, 2013-05-29

CONTESTANTS
Sam Hopkins, an M.B.A. student originally from Prairie Village, Kansas
Meena Puffer, a recruiter from Bear, Delaware
Mike Lewis, a systems engineer from Bloomington, Minnesota (whose 4-day cash winnings total $102,800)

OPENING REMARKS
Alex: Thank you, Johnny. Thank you, everyone. Viewers often ask what I talk to the contestants about at the end of each program. Well, at the end of yesterday's program, Mike and his two challengers and I were discussing the fact that it was an uneven game, and Mike didn't do as well as previously. He won --okay, he won over $10,000, but that dropped his average from $31,000 per victory to about $25,000 per victory. Poor Mike.

[Laughter]

Alex: Okay, Meena and Sam, you've got him on the ropes already. He's feeling terribly low, you know. Let's see what happens. Good luck, players. Here comes the Jeopardy! Round. And here come the categories, starting off with...

JEOPARDY! ROUND CATEGORIES
THE '60s (19th CENTURY EDITION) (4/5, including 1 missed Daily Double)
HONEY (4/5)
"ATH" & YOU SHALL RECEIVE (5/5) (Alex: Each correct response will end with those three letters.)
GYMNASTICS (5/5)
POETRY (5/5)
WHERE IS IT? (5/5)

THE RIGHTS & THE WRONGS
Sam: 12 R, 2 W
Mike: 9 R (including 1 rebound), 1 W (including 1 DD)
Meena: 7 R (including 1 rebound), 1 W

Clues revealed: 30
Triple Stumpers: 1
Jeopardy! Round Potential Lach Trash: $1,000



JEOPARDY! ROUND DAILY DOUBLE
Mike found the Daily Double on the 10th clue. Mike had $1,800, Meena was scoreless, and Sam was at $1,200. Mike made it a True Daily Double, wagering $1,800.

THE '60s (19th CENTURY EDITION) $1000: Texas joined the Confederacy in 1861 & forced this Unionist governor out of office
(Mike: Who is Austin?)

SCORES AT THE FIRST BREAK
Sam: $1,400
Mike: $600
Meena: $400

CONTESTANT INTERVIEWS



Alex: Until now, one of Sam Hopkins' main claims to fame was the fact that he speaks many, many languages. How many?

Sam: About 11.

Alex: 11, wow! What was the toughest one to learn?

Sam: You know, I get a kick out of all of them. So it's kind of over the course of time, when I started early learning Hebrew, which goes from right to left --I think a lot of people have trouble with that, so maybe I'm working backwards a little bit.

Alex: Okay. In terms of pronunciation, though?

Sam: Hebrew is tough, too, and since it's been sort of revitalized as a language in the past hundred years, there are even older sounds that today's Hebrew speakers don't tap into, so there's always more to explore.

Alex: All right.




Alex: Meena Puffer from Bear, Delaware, has an 11-year-old son and twins. How old are they?

Meena: They're 9. They'll be 10 in July.

Alex: And your daughter is a big fan of someone she never heard perform live.

Meena: Elvis Presley.

Alex: Really?

Meena: She's obsessed.

Alex: Got all his records and everything?

Meena: She does, she has them on CD, and she has them on her iPod, and she has posters, and she looks at all the videos on YouTube. She wants to go to Graceland for spring break.

Alex: Let her.

Meena: [laughs]

Alex: I mean take her.

Meena: Okay. [Laughs]

Alex: Yeah, that's better.




Alex: Mike Lewis is our champion. On yesterday's program, we had a contestant who knew exactly how they were gonna spend their money if they won. You now know how you're gonna spend some of the $102,000 that you've won.

Mike: Yes. We're gonna take a family trip over to Scotland.

Alex: Why Scotland?

Mike: My wife had studied abroad there for a year and fell in love with Scotland, and so --

Alex: Any place in particular?

Mike: Edinburgh and, of course, I want to see Loch Ness and try to find the monster. [chuckles]

Alex: And you know you can visit a lot of the Scottish distilleries along the coast, and they give you free samples. I know.

[Laughter]

Alex: I heard.

TRIPLE STUMPERS IN THE JEOPARDY! ROUND
HONEY $1000: Hummingbirds go wild for the Cape variety of this nectarous plant, seen here

SCORES AT THE END OF THE JEOPARDY! ROUND
Sam: $5,200
Mike: $4,600
Meena: $1,800

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Archivists » Wed May 29, 2013 11:30 am

DOUBLE JEOPARDY! ROUND CATEGORIES
WE'RE NOT IN KANSAS ANYMORE (4/5, including 1 missed Daily Double)
IT'S "NATIONAL" (5/5)
OPERATIC DEMISES (3/3, including 1 correct Daily Double)
DIRECTIONAL PEOPLE (4/5)
SLIM (2/5)
NUN (3/5) (Alex: And...)

THE RIGHTS & THE WRONGS
Sam: 8 R (including 1 rebound), 1 W
Mike: 9 R (including 1 DD), 2 W (including 1 DD)
Meena: 4 R, 1 W

Clues revealed: 28
Triple Stumpers: 6
Double Jeopardy! Round Potential Lach Trash: $8,800



FIRST DOUBLE JEOPARDY! ROUND DAILY DOUBLE
Mike snagged the next Daily Double on the 7th clue. Mike had $5,400, Meena had $2,600, and Sam was at $6,400. Mike wagered $2,000.

WE'RE NOT IN KANSAS ANYMORE $800: We're in this Missouri town visiting some of the unique shops like Pudd'n Heads & Aunt Polly's Treasures
(Mike: What is Branson?)
(Alex: No. "What is [*]?" You had to think of Mark Twain.)

SECOND DOUBLE JEOPARDY! ROUND DAILY DOUBLE
It was Mike who snatched up the last Daily Double of the game on the 28th clue. Mike had $8,600, Meena had $3,800, and Sam was at $14,400. Mike wagered $1,000.

OPERATIC DEMISES $1200: After delivering the head of John the Baptist, Herod orders his guards to crush her to death with their shields
[The end-of-round signal sounds.]

TRIPLE STUMPERS IN THE DOUBLE JEOPARDY! ROUND
NUN $1600: Susan Sarandon won an Oscar for playing this real-life nun in "Dead Man Walking"

NUN $2000: Ingrid Bergman earned an Oscar nomination for her role as a ball-playing nun in this sequel to "Going My Way"

DIRECTIONAL PEOPLE $2000: This "Joan of Arc" poet & Coleridge contemporary was from Bristol, England, not a certain paht of Baw-ston

SLIM $400: Add a "y" to the name of a tree to get this word meaning tall & slim

SLIM $1200: Jack Sprat's wife "could eat" none
(Meena: What is fat?)

SLIM $1600: Similar to "withered", it also starts with "wi" & means thin & shriveled
(Sam: What is wispy?)
...
(Alex: A minute to go now, Meena.)

SCORES ENTERING FINAL JEOPARDY!
Sam: $14,400
Mike: $9,600
Meena: $3,800

FINAL JEOPARDY! CATEGORY
AMERICAN MILITARY MEN

VENUSIAN MONOLOGUES/MARTIAN CHRONICLES
Two-thirds (exactly) for first place.
Sam: Wager $4,800 for the tie. Mike has cause to bet either nothing or everything, and you can't afford to lose by $1 to a nothing bet.
Mike: It's all or nothing, baby. You have even hope of returning to battle Sam next game if you wager $9,600 or $0. Either way, you're banking on a bet to tie by Sam and the ability to prevail in the future.
Meena: Unfortunately, your score is less than the difference between the scores of the first and second place players, so unless they both blunder, you're competing for second place and have no hopes of first. You can wager as much as you feel like, but since you'll have better chances of advancing to second place if you have a larger sum left over on a Triple Stumper, you might just want to wager $0.

FINAL JEOPARDY! CLUE
In April 1951 he told Congress, "in war there can be no substitute for victory"

FINAL SCORES
Meena: $3,800 + $3,000 = $6,800 (Who is McArthur?) (3rd place: $1,000)
Mike: $9,600 + $9,599 = $19,199 (Who is MacArthur?) (2nd place: $2,000)
Sam: $14,400 + $4,801 = $19,201 (Who is MacArthur?) (New champion: $19,201)

Total Potential Lach Trash: $9,800

GAME DYNAMICS
Image

CORYAT SCORES
Sam: $14,400, 20 R, 3 W
Mike: $13,600, 18 R (including 1 DD), 3 W (including 2 DDs)
Meena: $3,800, 11 R, 2 W
Combined Coryat: $31,800

BATTING AVERAGES
Sam: 21/58 = .362
Mike: 19/61 = .311
Meena: 12/58 = .207
Team: 52/63 = .825

MISCELLANEOUS INTERESTING CLUES
WHERE IS IT? $1000: The city:
the National Civil Rights Museum
(Sam: What is Selma?)
(Meena: What is Washington, D.C.?)

POETRY $600: (Sarah of the Clue Crew shows a poem on the monitor.) In an envelope stanza, the first line is considered "A" & rhymes with the last line of the quatrain; the middle two rhyme with each other, giving the entire rhyme this four-letter scheme

"ATH" & YOU SHALL RECEIVE $600: From the Greek for "learning", it proves a challenge for many
(Sam: What is empathy?)

POETRY $1000: (Jimmy of the Clue Crew shows a poem on the monitor.) The shape of a mouse's tail develops as you read a piece from "Alice's Adventures in Wonderland," so it's this type of poem that shares its name with a building material

IT'S "NATIONAL" $1600: Over the years, they've included Henry Kissinger, John Poindexter & General James L. Jones
(Mike: What is the chairman of the National Security Agency?)

IT'S "NATIONAL" $2000: Its East Building, completed in 1978 in Washington, D.C., was designed by I.M. Pei

CORRECT RESPONSES
Sam Houston
honeysuckle
Hannibal
Salome
Helen Prejean
The Bells of St. Mary's
Robert Southey
willowy
lean
wizened
General MacArthur
Memphis
A-B-B-A
math
concrete
the National Security Advisor
the National Gallery of Art

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jeff6286 » Wed May 29, 2013 3:55 pm

American Military Men
In April 1951 he told Congress, "In war there can be no substitute for victory."

SpoilerShow
Who is Douglas MacArthur?


Sam Hopkins: $14,400+$4,801=$19,201...now a 1-day champion with $19,201
Mike Lewis: $9,600+$9,599=$19,199
Meena Puffer: $3,800+$3,000=$6,800
Last edited by jeff6286 on Wed May 29, 2013 8:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by goforthetie » Wed May 29, 2013 5:06 pm

I see they're trying to make amends for yesterday's FJ. :roll:

Yet another opportunity for a lock-tie DD bet goes by the wayside.
Last edited by goforthetie on Wed May 29, 2013 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Bamaman » Wed May 29, 2013 5:06 pm

An easy FJ, not sure if it was Mc or Mac, wound up putting Mac.

On that last DD, I'm betting $1,400 and then think about the clue for as long as I can before they beep me.

In an exact 2/3 game with third locked out, I'd bet zero from second place.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by goforthetie » Wed May 29, 2013 5:10 pm

Bamaman wrote: In an exact 2/3 game with third locked out, I'd bet zero from second place.
Of course, if the leader is savvy, he'd bet for the tie. So all-in from second place wouldn't have been a bad choice, either.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Bamaman » Wed May 29, 2013 5:22 pm

goforthetie wrote:
Bamaman wrote: In an exact 2/3 game with third locked out, I'd bet zero from second place.
Of course, if the leader is savvy, he'd bet for the tie. So all-in from second place wouldn't have been a bad choice, either.
It would depend on the category for me. I felt pretty safe with this one. The reason I'd clam on my bet is that third is locked out. If third had more than half my score, then I'd definitely go all in.

If you are in the lead, you should always see how much you'd have if you make the MSB and get it wrong. If you're MSBIW is one dollar less than second's pre-FJ score, then you need to offer the tie. (Which you'd do anyway, but I digress).

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by TenPoundHammer » Wed May 29, 2013 7:27 pm

I had 16 right in DJ! and only 7 right in J! Odd.

====

Anyone notice the captions referred to "Where Is It?" as "Where It Is?"

There was more than one James brother?

"ABBA" rhyme when spotted the A's? Really?

"Blah blah blah parish in this state" was overvalued at $800. "Honey bear" was my only miss, since the only "Honey ____" animal I could think of was honey badger but "forest" ruled that out. Overthinking FTW!

Couldn't decipher the "path" clue at "Ath" for $200.

====

Hastings, NE? They have a dead mall. Council Bluffs was my only miss in that category; I just drew a total blank on Iowa.

"Willow" was my only miss in Slim, and even more surprisingly, the only $400 I didn't get.

Surprised at the TS on "His wife could eat no lean", especially after "fat" was negged.

====

Why the bleep did I say Truman?
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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by xxaaaxx » Wed May 29, 2013 7:30 pm

I don't know why I even considered the possibility of these contestants recognizing the 2/3 scenario and wagering properly :roll:

Instaget FJ. Figures that after missing two gettable FJs, I can only get on the board with an absolute gimme.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by econgator » Wed May 29, 2013 7:30 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:There was more than one James brother?
2 -- Jesse and Frank.

"Hmmmm ... I'm down a lot with less than a minute to go and there's still a DD left. Let's go to the low-value clues ...." OK ...

Insta-get FJ

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Austin Powers » Wed May 29, 2013 7:34 pm

Mike should have tanked the question and gone for the lock-tie or bet for the lead. IMHO. He slowplayed the end, going for the top of the board AGAIN, so I was not surprised that he bet a middling amount on the DD. I actually get why he avoided the bottom - a $2000 by the other guy would have been fatal - but probably what was at work was that he's a bit too risk averse in the endgame to be a five day champ.

Really disappointed that they could not find an ABBA song to show off an ABBA rhyme scheme.

I was completely thrown by the Southey question - I spent so much time trying to figure out what the hell the TOM was about that I realized too late that I just plain knew who the poet was (who was Poet Laureate, BTW).

The "thin" words category typifies some of the show's worst writing - imprecise allusions to often common words, with the valuations usually off. "Skinny" might have been the easiest clue there, since the clue tied it to a very common turn of phrase, and it was worth $2000. Meanwhile, "run through every tree in your head and add a -y to each one" is worth $400.

FJ basically could have said the category and just given the year and that would have been enough. "'Where did I leave my car keys?' said this man to a congressional page in 1951."
Last edited by Austin Powers on Wed May 29, 2013 7:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Austin Powers » Wed May 29, 2013 7:35 pm

econgator wrote:
TenPoundHammer wrote:There was more than one James brother?
2 -- Jesse and Frank.

"Hmmmm ... I'm down a lot with less than a minute to go and there's still a DD left. Let's go to the low-value clues ...." OK ...

Insta-get FJ
As I mentioned, I actually get why Mike did it. But the lady? She's way out of it, and the DD is the only way she has a shot. So she ploddingly goes for the $800 clue, because Maggie told her to start at the top and work your way down.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by xxaaaxx » Wed May 29, 2013 7:43 pm

Austin Powers wrote: The "thin" words category typifies some of the show's worst writing - imprecise allusions to often common words, with the valuations usually off. "Skinny" might have been the easiest clue there, since the clue tied it to a very common turn of phrase, and it was worth $2000. Meanwhile, "run through every tree in your head and add a -y to each one" is worth $400.
Plus I don't think I've ever heard someone called 'willowy'. Is that a common word for anyone here? I'm curious.

BTW was that the clue where 'wispy' was negged? I'm trying to remember why it was wrong, but I'm not sure. (ETA: apparently not. thanks)
Last edited by xxaaaxx on Wed May 29, 2013 8:25 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by ComingUpMilhouse » Wed May 29, 2013 7:49 pm

xxaaaxx wrote:
Austin Powers wrote: The "thin" words category typifies some of the show's worst writing - imprecise allusions to often common words, with the valuations usually off. "Skinny" might have been the easiest clue there, since the clue tied it to a very common turn of phrase, and it was worth $2000. Meanwhile, "run through every tree in your head and add a -y to each one" is worth $400.
Plus I don't think I've ever heard someone called 'willowy'. Is that a common word for anyone here? I'm curious.

BTW was that the clue where 'wispy' was negged? I'm trying to remember why it was wrong, but I'm not sure.
The clue asked for a term you get when you add "y" to the name of a tree, and "wisp" isn't a type of tree as far as I know.

Edit: that wasn't the clue with the wispy neg, so never mind.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Austin Powers » Wed May 29, 2013 8:05 pm

xxaaaxx wrote:
Austin Powers wrote: The "thin" words category typifies some of the show's worst writing - imprecise allusions to often common words, with the valuations usually off. "Skinny" might have been the easiest clue there, since the clue tied it to a very common turn of phrase, and it was worth $2000. Meanwhile, "run through every tree in your head and add a -y to each one" is worth $400.
Plus I don't think I've ever heard someone called 'willowy'. Is that a common word for anyone here? I'm curious.

BTW was that the clue where 'wispy' was negged? I'm trying to remember why it was wrong, but I'm not sure.
"Willowy" is definitely a word; it might have been used at one point to describe Kate Moss, pre-heroin. My beef is that you've got a vague category and, boom, the first one out is this question which basically asks you first and foremost to recall a tree - which, by how most of ours minds will work, we'll start to do immediately, and then make another word out of it, without telling you anything about the tree. I can just about guarantee that all three of those contestants are familiar with the word "willowy," so the failure of any of them to pick up on it as a $400 really suggests that the writers didn't send the proper signal.

The thing is, Jeopardy has questions that work by implication and suggestion, but usually something very concrete in the clue points to a very concrete answer. A TOM about the guy in Cast Away that leads you to Nancy Hanks, which leads you to Abraham Lincoln, works on a subtle level, but in a sense the connections are all quite specific and discrete. "Think of a tree" then "think of a word meaning 'thin'" lacks that precision. There are a zillion kinds of trees out there. "Think of a tree that Mr. Toad might be fond of, then think of a word meaning 'thin'" has a little more meat to it. That's an actual $400 question.

Now, regarding your other question. "Wizened" is what they wanted, because it has a negative implication, whereas "wispy" doesn't. But given "wi-" and a sense that the word means 'thin,' you'll run immediately to wispy, because wispy conveys "thin" in a way that "wizened" doesn't - "wizened" really is better said to mean "shriveled." Oops, it turns out that they wanted something a bit harsher, but, too late! You've missed it, tough.

But very few people are walking dictionaries who contain how and what context should what words be used. Words are vague things, and sometimes a word can have a positive connotation, and sometimes a negative one. Context is huge. Jeopardy traditionally worked on a Pavlovian level - if it wants Lincoln, it will mention something specific, like he's the 16th president. They've had wordplay categories as long as I can remember, but in recent years they've become a touch more vague, as if the writers are familiar with all the questions that have been asked, and think you are, too, so they can ask questions by intimation. Just a random game I hit upon, just now, literally the first one I hit upon from a random season from the 90s:

http://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=1963

This has a perfectly reasonable wordplay category in the J round. Each clue gives you two ways of coming up with the answer, meaning that, by combining the two paths, you can get the one unique answer that the writers want. Sometimes, I feel that the writers lately will only give you one of those paths, and the question becomes "what am I thinking?" The "Wizened" question you're complaining about spent half its space discussing "withered" - when it really needed to be pointing you toward "wizened," maybe by making a play on "wizard" or something.

/rant over

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by StrangerCoug » Wed May 29, 2013 8:28 pm

Could somebody repost National for $1,200 and $1,600 please (both the clues and the responses)? We had reception trouble and ended up not seeing those in full.

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jeff6286 » Wed May 29, 2013 8:31 pm

StrangerCoug wrote:Could somebody repost National for $1,200 and $1,600 please (both the clues and the responses)? We had reception trouble and ended up not seeing those in full.
$1200: Part of NOAA, it issues watches and warnings for tornadoes, hurricanes, etc.

$1600: Over the years, they've included Henry Kissinger, John Poindexter, and General James L. Jones.

The correct responses:
SpoilerShow
National Weather Service
National Security Advisors

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Bamaman » Wed May 29, 2013 8:33 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:


Why the bleep did I say Truman?
At least you didn't say Hitler, you'd be banned from the Sony board.

For the poetry clue, I said "Abba" (like the band), rather than spelling it out.. Judges?

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by marpocky » Wed May 29, 2013 8:40 pm

I second (or really, like, sixth) everything said so far about willowy, wispy, wizened, skinny, etc. Just a bad category all around.

Not quite instaget FJ for me, as I spent a few seconds trying to remember if it was Patton or MacArthur in charge in Korea. Then I remembered Patton died in 1945 (which I learned due to the recent FJ involving that year).

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Re: Wednesday, May 29, 2013 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jeff6286 » Wed May 29, 2013 8:40 pm

Shun Fujimoto was Kerri Strug 20 years earlier, though he didn't need Bela to carry him to the medal stand. From Wikipedia:
Fujimoto achieved fame by continuing to compete in the team event right after breaking his knee during the floor exercise. He scored 9.5 on the pommel horse and 9.7 on the rings with a broken knee, dismounting from the rings from eight feet above ground and keeping his balance after landing on his feet. He "raised his arms in a perfect finish before collapsing in agony" The dismount worsened his injury, dislocating his broken kneecap and tearing ligaments in his right leg. Doctors ordered him to withdraw from further competition or risk permanent disability. One doctor stated:
"How he managed to do somersaults and twists and land without collapsing in screams is beyond my comprehension."
One difference was that Fujimoto's routine was not the last of the competition like Strug's. There were still 3 rotations remaining after his rings performance, so his fortitude may have helped to inspire his teammates to reach the gold, in addition to providing the scores that helped get them there.

Of course I missed this clue, thinking of the Strug comparison and saying "vault" for "landing on this final move". If I had known it was rings I would have gotten it, but I was thinking "final routine" rather than final move of a routine.

From what I've been able to find, it appears that the quote in the FJ clue was not entirely accurate. Google serach provided many transcriptions of the full speech, including this one, that have the portion in question as "In war, there is no substitute for victory."

The passage used in the FJ clue, according to this diary entry, is inscribed on a wall at the Douglas MacArthur Memorial in Norfolk, Virginia.
“A great nation which voluntarily enters upon war and does not see it through to victory must eventually suffer all the consequences of defeat… War’s very object is victory, not prolonged indecision. In war, there can be no substitute for victory.”
Google search provides many other uses of this phrase listing it as being used in the speech to Congress.

Obviously the difference between "is no difference" and "can be no difference" is pretty minimal, and it's likely that MacArthur may have used both versions at various times, but given the fact that they specifically referenced the address to Congress, why would they not get the wording exactly right? If anyone thinks I'm nitpicking too much, just let me know, and I'll take my beef to the Sony board instead. :lol:

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