The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sat Mar 10, 2018 5:47 pm

RKane wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:49 pm
By the way did you read the document I made last night? (http://m.uploadedit.com/bbtc/1520673351592.txt) I was out drinking last night for most of the responses I sent you but when I got home I couldn't sleep so I made that detailed document.
That appendix completely lost me almost immediately.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by RKane » Sat Mar 10, 2018 6:06 pm

That's too bad, because it's effectively a self-contained answer to the question, and is actually more clear than the STEPS 1 - 6.

Let's discuss the appendix line by line:
Okay, well, note that the numbers 53 and 28 actually represent a certain amount of things.
I hope that's obvious. The point of numbers is to represent quantities.
In particular, we know, from the decimal system, that
We are now going to break down what the symbol "53" means. You probably learned in school that the rightmost column is the one's column and the second-rightmost column (here, the leftmost column since it is a two-digit number) is the tens's column. That is, the rightmost column represents the amount of one's in a number, and the second-rightmost column represents the amount of ten's in a number. Later in the Appendix, we explain this idea in more detail, examine why it is useful, and show that there is nothing special about the number ten. For now:
53 = 5 * 10 + 3 * 1
Where * is obviously the multiplication symbol. As I said above, the number in the one's column, here 3, is the number of one's, and the number in the ten's column, here 5, is the number of tens. That is, 53 has three one's and five ten's in it. Explicitly:

(*) 53 = 10 + 10 + 10 + 10 + 10 + 1 + 1 + 1
However, this is already a bit long, so we can use multiplication to write this (more) succinctly:

53 = 5 * 10 + 3 * 1

Since we had five 10's and three 1's, we multiply 5 by 10 and 3 by 1.

Simiarly, we obtain:
28 = 2 * 10 + 8 * 1
Your job: Understand this, and write out 28 in a similar format to how I wrote 53 in line (*) above.

That's your homework right now. I should be able to post a little later tonight, if you get that far, we will move onto the next sentence of the Appendix. Actually, that sentence is a little confusing so we will go on to the "long form" posing of question.

-
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by jeffwolfe » Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:06 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:26 pm
why should I not brace myself for the hideously obscure every time?
How's that working out for you? If it's working for you, great, keep at it. If you haven't been having much success lately, maybe you might consider trying something different. The choice is yours.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by 1stlvlthinker » Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:40 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:18 am
1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:22 am
This is a great point. There's 2 possibilities here:

1) The answer is really obscure. If that is true, you're not going to get the answer anyways.

2) The answer is not obscure at all. If this is true, you should be able to reason out a educated guess.

Setting aside that 2 is way more common than 1, you only have a shot at 2 anyways, so you might as well assume it's not obscure and take a good guess. Assuming it's totally obscure and giving up will get you 0 questions right each and every time.
Since 1 HAS happened though, I'm bracing myself for it every time

I still don't see how I was supposed to know it'd even be a tech company.
Seriously though, that's not the point. If it's #1, then you're not getting it right anyways, so why waste time thinking about it. Assume it's #2 each and every time (which is close to the actual percentage), and then work on it from there.

The clue in question was about a company in California. You should have SOME idea of what happens in California. Tech companies are one. If you guessed some sort of agriculture or food based company, I'd say that's a pretty good guess. Guessing a movie type of company is another one. Guessing nothing is just giving up.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:59 am

1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:40 pm
Seriously though, that's not the point. If it's #1, then you're not getting it right anyways, so why waste time thinking about it. Assume it's #2 each and every time (which is close to the actual percentage), and then work on it from there.
But what's "obvious" to the rest of you is not obvious to me. I know nothing about "Lord of the Flies" because it seems like every time it comes up, there's a totally different TOM for it and I've never been able to piece together any Pavlovs for it. I can't remember any ancient kings or queens because they always dissolve into a mishmash of Roman numerals -- how should I know that any particular thing is tied to Louis XIV and not the XIII Louises before him?
1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:40 pm
The clue in question was about a company in California. You should have SOME idea of what happens in California. Tech companies are one. If you guessed some sort of agriculture or food based company, I'd say that's a pretty good guess. Guessing a movie type of company is another one. Guessing nothing is just giving up.
Because I had no idea where to begin. I got as far as "there are lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of companies based in California" and saw nothing in the clue to narrow it down to tech companies.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by 1stlvlthinker » Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:17 am

TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:59 am
1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:40 pm
Seriously though, that's not the point. If it's #1, then you're not getting it right anyways, so why waste time thinking about it. Assume it's #2 each and every time (which is close to the actual percentage), and then work on it from there.
But what's "obvious" to the rest of you is not obvious to me. I know nothing about "Lord of the Flies" because it seems like every time it comes up, there's a totally different TOM for it and I've never been able to piece together any Pavlovs for it. I can't remember any ancient kings or queens because they always dissolve into a mishmash of Roman numerals -- how should I know that any particular thing is tied to Louis XIV and not the XIII Louises before him?
What does that have to do with what I wrote? You were complaining about a clue being completely obscure, but now you're complaining the clues aren't obvious. There are areas in between where you might have to actually use your brain. The point is, you were giving up before because the clues were "always too obscure" (they're not). And now, you're giving up because they're not immediately obvious? Stop moving the goalposts and accept that you should try every now and then.
TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:59 am
1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 11:40 pm
The clue in question was about a company in California. You should have SOME idea of what happens in California. Tech companies are one. If you guessed some sort of agriculture or food based company, I'd say that's a pretty good guess. Guessing a movie type of company is another one. Guessing nothing is just giving up.
Because I had no idea where to begin. I got as far as "there are lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of companies based in California" and saw nothing in the clue to narrow it down to tech companies.
Again, you're completely ignoring what I wrote there. Yes, there are lots and lots of companies based in California, but if you can suss it out any way, then you have a better shot at it. Thinking California is known for nothing will get you nowhere.

Let's work this out. First assume the clue is not obscure. Because if it is, you won't get it anyways, and you might as well not worry about it. Second, now figure out what California might be known for. You can't possibly tell me you know NOTHING about California. Even if you don't get to a tech company, there are other industries.

Ever heard of Hollywood? That's the movie industry.
California is really huge, and not Alaska, so probably a lot of agriculture.
Napa Valley and Sonoma make a lot of wine.
California is on the Pacific Oceans, so maybe a shipping company?

None of these are right of course, but they are better than absolutely nothing.

Try to read what other people write one of these days.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by Ironhorse » Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:00 pm

Way over the top, dude.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by Bamaman » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:31 pm

Ironhorse wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:00 pm
Way over the top, dude.
He just said what most of us have thought on a number of occasions.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:44 pm

1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:17 am
What does that have to do with what I wrote? You were complaining about a clue being completely obscure, but now you're complaining the clues aren't obvious. There are areas in between where you might have to actually use your brain. The point is, you were giving up before because the clues were "always too obscure" (they're not). And now, you're giving up because they're not immediately obvious? Stop moving the goalposts and accept that you should try every now and then.
Everything is "too obscure" to those who lack knowledge. If the category is "The French and Indian War", and I couldn't even tell you what century or continent that took place, so what could I even put down as a WAG at that point?
1stlvlthinker wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 11:17 am
Again, you're completely ignoring what I wrote there. Yes, there are lots and lots of companies based in California, but if you can suss it out any way, then you have a better shot at it. Thinking California is known for nothing will get you nowhere.
Thinking "California is known for TOO MANY things for me to even begin to hazard a guess" is more like it. I know a LOT of industries based in California, including technology, entertainment, agriculture, etc. But I still felt that picking any of those over the other was a roll of the dice. And as said many times, I absolutely hate to guess.

====

And honestly, I'm frustrated with myself too. All I want to do is get out of my own way and stop overthinking or underthinking everything. I think my frustration over my failures is what leads me to constantly scream "HOW WAS ANYONE SUPPOSED TO KNOW THAT?!" over everything. My frustration makes me not even try to grasp basic concepts like elementary school math. And just like any other minor setback I encounter, I just frustrate everyone up to and including myself to the point that it boils over. So I just give up, usually with a temper tantrum involved.

And I think that's what I want to remove but don't know how. Even going in with an optimistic outlook has far too often led to me falling on my face so hard that I create an aftershock. Confirmation bias? Maybe. But I don't know what the secret is to finding the right middle ground. I don't know how to just get out of my own way, how to just relax and take things in, how not to get so overheated when I miss, etc. etc.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:51 pm

Bamaman wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:31 pm
Ironhorse wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:00 pm
Way over the top, dude.
He just said what most of us have thought on a number of occasions.
At least you guys manage to think it without implying that I commit illegal sex acts. Get pissed off at me if you want, but don't insult me or my peers.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by RKane » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:18 pm

I never said it was illegal. It's obviously simulated and the "animals" are people in a costume.

much like S&M clubs are not illegal because they do not actually involve people being chained and spanked against their will.

But I have edited the post anyway
Last edited by RKane on Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:21 pm

Deleted
Last edited by TenPoundHammer on Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by RKane » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:30 pm

I know nothing of the sort and nor do I care.

Anyways I have edited both posts.

However it occurs to me that choice of words was actually serendipitous.

You know how you have constantly explain to people you are not into illegal sex acts and no one ever seems to get it through their head and you get nowhere?

That's how people feel in this topic when trying to explain things to you.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by TenPoundHammer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:34 pm

RKane wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:30 pm
You know how you have constantly explain to people you are not into illegal sex acts and no one ever seems to get it through their head and you get nowhere?

That's how people feel in this topic when trying to explain things to you.
It's also how I feel when I try and fail and fail and fail and fail and fail at learning anything because I can't get out of my own goddamn way.
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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by Peter the accountant » Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:55 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:34 pm
It's also how I feel when I try and fail and fail and fail and fail and fail at learning anything because I can't get out of my own goddamn way.
Please don't take this the wrong way, because I really do want to help you.

It sounds to me like your issue is way bigger than a stupid trivia game. Have you talked to a doctor to rule out medical and/or mental issues? It's perfectly normal to feel the way you've expressed above from time to time. It's not normal to feel that way all of the time. And it seems to be you've been saying similar things for several months.

I'd get off this board for a while, turn off Jeopardy!, and go interact with people in person. If that doesn't help you feel better about yourself, please seek out some professional assistance.
--Peter

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by tiwonge » Sun Mar 11, 2018 4:53 pm

TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:59 am
every time it comes up
Do you try to learn about things you remember coming up more than once? Maybe, if Lord of the Flies comes up a lot, read the book or read a plot summary? (I know you can't do this for everything, but maybe after every game, find something you remember seeing before, and read about it.)

ETA: You could even make it easier on yourself by trying to pick a common topic that gets asked a lot, rather than just anything. J! likes geography, so maybe every time there's a geography category, look up some of the countries or rivers or lakes, and learn where they are, what they border, capitols, tributaries, etc. Or Shakespeare--pick a Shakespearean question you did not get, and learn about that play--plot, characters, setting, etc. (On days without the topic you are focusing on, you could just pick any other topic to learn about.)

Even with reading about it, you might get things mixed up a bit, but eventually, hopefully, you'll learn something that might stick.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by squarekara » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:00 pm

I don't look in on this thread very often, so forgive me if this question was addressed weeks, months, or years ago, but with what stated goal does this discussion proceed? Is it just daily spoon feeding of information related to that day's game, or is there a larger framework? A prescribed curriculum? The frustration in today's posts is too, too visceral. I wholeheartedly agree that sifting through random trivia about, say, European rulers can become a confusing jumble of roman numerals. But any basic high school World History textbook will tell you what distinguishes Louis XIV from any other Louis. If it matters to you, get on it.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by Stanislaus Jacob » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:19 pm

Peter the accountant wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 3:55 pm
TenPoundHammer wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:34 pm
It's also how I feel when I try and fail and fail and fail and fail and fail at learning anything because I can't get out of my own goddamn way.
Please don't take this the wrong way, because I really do want to help you.

It sounds to me like your issue is way bigger than a stupid trivia game. Have you talked to a doctor to rule out medical and/or mental issues? It's perfectly normal to feel the way you've expressed above from time to time. It's not normal to feel that way all of the time. And it seems to be you've been saying similar things for several months.

I'd get off this board for a while, turn off Jeopardy!, and go interact with people in person. If that doesn't help you feel better about yourself, please seek out some professional assistance.
Also remember that you are an authentic game show champion! Some of the other posters here also are champions, but most of us are not, even though we might dearly like to be. You can claim genuine superiority over us in this respect. I hoped your success on Wheel of Fortune would bring you some peace of mind and am truly sorry and sad that instead these days you seem more frustrated and angry rather than less.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by seaborgium » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:20 pm

squarekara wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:00 pm
I don't look in on this thread very often, so forgive me if this question was addressed weeks, months, or years ago, but with what stated goal does this discussion proceed? Is it just daily spoon feeding of information related to that day's game, or is there a larger framework? A prescribed curriculum? The frustration in today's posts is too, too visceral. I wholeheartedly agree that sifting through random trivia about, say, European rulers can become a confusing jumble of roman numerals. But any basic high school World History textbook will tell you what distinguishes Louis XIV from any other Louis. If it matters to you, get on it.
The only purpose of this thread is to keep such discussion out of the daily discussion threads.

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Re: The Official TPH Education Thread (POTENTIAL GAME DAY SPOILERS)

Post by CailinGaoilge » Sun Mar 11, 2018 9:38 pm

RKane wrote:
Sat Mar 10, 2018 6:06 pm
That's too bad, because it's effectively a self-contained answer to the question, and is actually more clear than the STEPS 1 - 6.

Let's discuss the appendix line by line:
Okay, well, note that the numbers 53 and 28 actually represent a certain amount of things.
I hope that's obvious. The point of numbers is to represent quantities.
In particular, we know, from the decimal system, that
We are now going to break down what the symbol "53" means. You probably learned in school that the rightmost column is the one's column and the second-rightmost column (here, the leftmost column since it is a two-digit number) is the tens's column. That is, the rightmost column represents the amount of one's in a number, and the second-rightmost column represents the amount of ten's in a number. Later in the Appendix, we explain this idea in more detail, examine why it is useful, and show that there is nothing special about the number ten. For now:
53 = 5 * 10 + 3 * 1
Where * is obviously the multiplication symbol. As I said above, the number in the one's column, here 3, is the number of one's, and the number in the ten's column, here 5, is the number of tens. That is, 53 has three one's and five ten's in it. Explicitly:

(*) 53 = 10 + 10 + 10 + 10 + 10 + 1 + 1 + 1
However, this is already a bit long, so we can use multiplication to write this (more) succinctly:

53 = 5 * 10 + 3 * 1

Since we had five 10's and three 1's, we multiply 5 by 10 and 3 by 1.

Simiarly, we obtain:
28 = 2 * 10 + 8 * 1
Your job: Understand this, and write out 28 in a similar format to how I wrote 53 in line (*) above.

That's your homework right now. I should be able to post a little later tonight, if you get that far, we will move onto the next sentence of the Appendix. Actually, that sentence is a little confusing so we will go on to the "long form" posing of question.

-
I do understand that this - and other math-filled posts by others - is intended to be helpful. However, I believe it was established a while ago as very likely that TPH is dyscalculic. As another person with dyscalculia, I can tell you that seeing line after line of numbers and mathematical instructions unfortunately sends my brain screaming in the opposite direction: not only can I not take it in, but it might as well be written in Ancient Greek for all the sense it initially makes, and even trying to make sense of it gives me a headache.

There are times when I can do mental arithmetic, and times when my brain goes around and around in circles trying to figure out something as simple as 17 - 9. If I feel under pressure in any way, that's when I either come up with nothing or guess wildly at anything just to have an answer. I have had to acknowledge that anything mathematical is not my forte - and, not that I'd ever be on the show anyway, I'd never be able to work out appropriate DD and FJ wagers.

But not being able to cope with numbers does NOT make anyone stupid, TPH. It's a learning disability - and many very intelligent people have learning disabilities.

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