Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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jgpeterson
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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by jgpeterson » Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:13 am

aggiebud wrote:Wow - what a game...I had forgotten exactly how ugly that game was.

And my reaction - I was absolutely shocked to have won. Jay outplayed me for the whole game. He tried to put the game away with the first daily double, and it backfired. It went downhill for him after that. Even then - he was within striking distance in FJ. When they revealed the Redgrave sisters as his response, I was certain he was right and was ready to congratulate him. When he missed it, and I knew I had won, it was all I could do to keep it together - and I'm not sure I did that good a job.
As we all know, it's about holding the game together, especially when you feel like it's not going your way, as you must have felt when Jay was finding his rhythms. However, don't sell yourself short - you stuck around and stuck around and found a way to win - isn't that the cliche about a true champion, finding a way to win? You and Jay were both top-shelf players - you deserved a finals berth.

Oh, and your one really animated and ingenuous response when you negged - loved it! Showed real character that we seldom see on the game.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by harrumph » Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:24 am

Correct me if I'm wrong, but we had two wildcard contestants in today's game, and for tomorrow's we will have three winners. What is up with the seeding?

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by dhkendall » Fri Nov 11, 2011 12:49 am

SavoyGirl wrote:ZsaZsa and Eva? Really?
I was all set to not tell anyone on the board my answer that stuck with me around second #3 and had such a stranglehold on my thought process that it refused to let me think of, or put down, anything else ... until I saw the eventual game winner give the same answer. Yes, I knew we were wrong, and yes, I figured he did it for the lolz (I still have no idea why I did it, or rather why the name came to me early and refused to let go), but I feel a little better about my answer now, and am not (quite so ;)) embarrassed about it.

NoWhammies10 wrote:As with (and as of) tonight, I will be using an asterisk (*) to denote if a ruling was reversed for a particular player on a given clue, good or bad. This is NOT reflected in the actual Coryat score, as per the rules of Coryat scores. And should such an event arise, multiple asterisks will be used for multiple ruling reversals by TPTB.
:o :o Show me in the actual Coryat rules where it says that judging reversals are not counted??? The Archive sure as heck counts them and I've been known to change my score if my answer that was negged was corrected.
DBear wrote:Hardest boards of the tournament. No runs at all, even in usual strengths such as European Geography.
Same here, but at least I ran European Geography (can always count on a geography cat to help me out in a bad board. Thank goodness Alex is another geography geek). Was surprised, despite all my clams, that I actually pulled away with a $19,600 Coryat today! (Anything $20K or over is a "good game" in my book, considering how rough this board was and how close I was to $20K, I'll take it today). I think the difference is, on boards where my Coryat is low, every single time it's due to lots of wrong answers, whereas today, the boards were total dogs, but I was wise enough to clam on almost everything I didn't know, and that's what the difference was that made this (barely) into "good game" territory. If ever I'll be asked for the secret to winning on Jeopardy! (I can only fervently hope that this situation will be plausible someday), I'll quickly answer with "answer the question only when you're positive on the answer."
Woppy T wrote:instaget FJ for me, but only becase I happened to watch "Suspicion" on TCM a few months ago,
Heh, interestingly, similar process led me to get Roseanne. If I was asked this question when the clue was taped, I wouldn't have had a clue, but I saw an ad for "Roseanne's Nuts" (yes, that's the name of it) on TV a few days ago - something like that stays with a fellow for several reasons.

And interesting to see how many of y'all watch classic movies, seems like almost as many as enjoy crossword puzzles around here! I like crosswords, but I'm not into classic movies (or almost any movies really, don't have the attention span for them, especially if I come in in the middle of the movie). My wife does almost nothing but watch TCM and AMC (I can hear her in the living room in the floor directly above me doing just that right now). I also think she's pretty smart too ... Maybe I should force myself to watch one of these movies with her, upshot being I spend more time with her as well.
katiedidwhat wrote: I was most impressed with Buddy's ability to shake off being in the red and just keep ringing in and answering.
That's pretty much Standard Jeopardy Operating Procedure right there, you can't do that, you're guaranteed not to win your game. You probably don't even belong there in the first place.
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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by econgator » Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:47 am

Congrats, Buddy! Welcome to the Finals!

That was, indeed, a brutal set of boards. I think I got 1 of the first 10 clues uncovered (The SSA? Huh?) and they didn't really get too much better the rest of the game.

I started FJ with the Redgraves, but about half way in remembered deHavilland/Fontaine (and labula, the ballet dancer is Dame Margot Fonteyn) and stayed with them. Kinda shocked myself by getting it, actually.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by JoshuaRQI » Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:05 am

harrumph wrote:Correct me if I'm wrong, but we had two wildcard contestants in today's game, and for tomorrow's we will have three winners. What is up with the seeding?
All of the contestants are amazing, but I'm still puzzled by the matchups. I would have picked Roger and Joon to go to the Finals with Tom before the tournament started, then after the quarterfinals I certainly wouldn't have put the highest scorers in the same semifinal. I mean, Roger had $40,000 BEFORE final jeopardy. Joon ended with some 30k. Mark won his matchup (technically) with a high final score. Those three should be in separate games, or at least you would expect Joon and Roger to be separated since Justin was the dominant player in his quarterfinal.

But yeah, even though today had two wildcard contestants, it was a brutal board for me. The Order category was easy, in a sense, but starting where they did you kept wondering whether you were thinking of the order or were thinking too deep or too shallow in the thread.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by SavoyGirl » Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:05 am

Surprised at how few people are familiar with Joan Fontaine and Olivia deHaviland. Guess they've both been out of the spotlight for a while. Joan auditioned for Scarlett in Gone With the Wind but was offered Melanie. She turned up her nose at a second lead and suggested they get her sister. They did.

Later Vivien Leigh wanted to appear opposite husband Laurence Olivier in Rebecca, but she was considered too pretty for the role of the mousy second wife. So Joan got that role and an Oscar.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by barandall800 » Fri Nov 11, 2011 4:37 am

cheezguyty wrote:
jeff6286 wrote:Did anyone else out there ever not know if these 2 same-named actresses were related?
I was just about to post the same thing. I absolutely cannot believe I never knew that before! :oops:
I didn't know until a few months ago...and even with that recent revelation under my belt, it took me about 15 seconds to say to myself after I quickly answered with Katharine and Audrey, "Wait a minute...THEY'RE NOT RELATED!" From then on I was absolutely stuck. For some strange reason, Sissy Spacek kept coming to my head. I totally thought Jay was correct with Vanessa & Lynn, too. I think I was randomly reading Olivia de Havilland's Wiki article a few months ago and found out her and Joan Fontaine were sisters, but it definitely didn't stick in my mind at all.

I ran two categories today (2011 Emmys and Pop Culture...AKA huge wheelhouses), but I agree that these boards were crazy. That Order category was a real piece of work, for sure. Nice to see Foster the People get a J! mention, btw. ("Pumped Up Kicks" isn't all they have to offer...their entire debut album is terrific.) (ETA: Also loved the Cat Deeley clue. She is one of the best hosts on TV hands-down, and, well, she's quite beautiful as well. Ahem. :))

Buddy, you fought through some nasty categories, and it was great to see you climb back from the red. Your post-FJ reaction was a great moment. Welcome to the finals! :)

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Rafferty Barnes » Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:03 am

I read about them in Inside Oscar http://www.amazon.com/Inside-Oscar-10th ... 241&sr=1-2, a great sticky way to remember the early Oscars. The Fontaine-de Havilland story is one of the juiciest. Olivia used to tear up the clothes her little sister had to wear as hand-me-downs! When Joan won her Oscar, she brushed by Olivia who had stood up to congratulate her. Olivia did the same a few years later when she won.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by NJCondon » Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:09 am

Congrats to Buddy for hanging in there in a very tough game! And seeing someone who was expressive as you were on stage is a nice change; most contestants (myself very much included) don't seem to be able to relax enough to show a genuine emotion stronger than "mild disappointment" or "moderate happiness."

The "Orders" category was a run for me, thanks to my strangely good recollection of my high school biology classes. I was surprised they accepted the English rather than Latin names ("carnivores" instead of "Carnivora"). I was also a bit surprised that someone like Jay, who is both very sharp and (presumably, given his career) educated in biology wouldn't have pulled out a couple of those.

The FJ! was, like a lot of them this tournament, pretty much a "know it or don't" sort of question. It's disappointing, since it would be more fun to watch competitors at this level exercise their (no doubt considerable) tease-out abilities. I guessed the Redgraves, too, after discarding the Hepburns on some vague memory that they weren't related. I wouldn't have gotten the correct answer in a million years.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by shubhaghosh » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:02 am

aggiebud wrote:I think we were all gun-shy at the category to even try to pull the trigger on Primates or Rodents. I know I was gun-shy on Patton, even though I was pretty sure that was right.

First of all: congratulations, Buddy. That was an awesome game. As will be the next three. I got a chuckle out of the Patton TS since "Patton" was the answer to my first DD in the only game I ever played. Recognized the picture though.

Orders were tricky, especially in one instance I confused Phylum with Order. FJ was a great question; I missed the word "first" in the clue and went for the Redgraves. Would have thought twice if I saw the word "first," but probably would not have gotten it in time. It was a fact I knew once but put away. Kind of like the name of the woman who stabbed Marat....

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by legendneverdies » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:16 am

MarkBarrett wrote:Jay could not hear me begging him to dig up Zworykin.
Zworykin's name will be referenced in Final J! tomorrow, on the GSN rerun of Vik Vaz game three. THe clue asked about what the alphabetically last person mentioned in the Britannica in 2005 was a co-inventor of. Vik was the only one to make the Zworykin/TV connection.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by LeFlaneur » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:56 am

aggiebud wrote:Wow - what a game...I had forgotten exactly how ugly that game was.

So let me address a few of the questions that have come along in the thread thus far:

Yes - Eva and Zsa Zsa was a complete joke answer. I have always believed, if you can't be right, be funny. As to why I didn't get the last name down...I simply ran out of time. I sat and stared at that clue for half of the time allotted before I decided I had to write something.

As for Budphrey's question - why was I clapping so loud on the DD's: Just like a kid who moves to a new school, and the first friend he makes is his best friend...Jay was the first person I met at the hotel during the taping, and he is one of the nicest, funniest people I've ever met. We bonded instantly, and I was sick when we had to play one another. I obviously wanted to win, but if I couldn't, I had no problem with Jay beating me. He was ahead by $4800 - hit the daily double - and I knew he was about to put the game away. No reason not to be a good sport and cheer for a friend.

I think you can tell how close we all were by the hugs at the end of the match.

And my reaction - I was absolutely shocked to have won. Jay outplayed me for the whole game. He tried to put the game away with the first daily double, and it backfired. It went downhill for him after that. Even then - he was within striking distance in FJ. When they revealed the Redgrave sisters as his response, I was certain he was right and was ready to congratulate him. When he missed it, and I knew I had won, it was all I could do to keep it together - and I'm not sure I did that good a job.

Congrats on a hard fought win against 2 tough opponents. What you said about Jay and your spirited competition is what Jeopardy is all about, camraderie and good sportsmanship. As far as displays of emotion that's cool too. Personally I think the only one I displayed was abject fear. Best of retro luck to you in the finals. Gig 'em.
Le Flaneur

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by goforthetie » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:15 am

Wow, those were some tough and painful boards. Seemed like each contestant had at least one category that was their nemesis, providing multiple negs...

Are there more than 5 Vladimirs that are J! material? I suppose if one were extremely fast and good (or just decided not to pay attention while the other DJ categories were being played) one may have been able to pre-call all five clues in that category.

For about 10 seconds in FJ, I was trying to think of sister Emmy nominees. Thankfully I remembered that had been covered in the J round and re-read the category. Not the greatest FJ clue - either you know it or you don't. I feel bad for Jay, who came up with what is probably the most plausible sounding answer.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Mark B » Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:25 am

I'd be curious to know how many negs there were in this game. I didn't count them, but it seemed like a lot for tourney game. At least part of the reason for it was the number of clues that were misvalued. Self Storage Association?

Anyone else precall Vladimir Guerrero? I even expected to see him in the bottom box.

I had a ton of Lach trash too, but this is one case where it must have been waaaaaay harder in the studio, because the players were legitimately losing confidence in the board.

FJ was instant for me. Well, instant if you count "Who are Olivia de Havilland and Bette Davis?" as correct. Total atrophy. I tried to think of any other decent candidates and did not come up with the Redgraves, but if I had, it would have been a dilemma. The fact that the sister act has happened twice makes this a pretty mean clue.

I really feel for Jay. That's a tough loss. I personally liked his dd hunting as a strategy, and thought his bets made sense. He just couldn't pull the answers. In the end, this match wasn't won or lost, it was survived.

Finally, like so many others, I'm at a loss to explain Friday's line-up.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Volante » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:16 am

cinemaniax7 wrote:Rough game for Jay, good night for me. I picked up several triple stumpers and cruised through FJ, though I expect Joan and Olivia will garner one of the lowest "get" percentages of the season among board members. Rarely have I seen three contestants more frozen immediately after the FJ reveal. Because the actresses did not go by the same last name, I didn't expect any of them would come up with it.
That's were I pretty much got held up. "Ok, two actresses...and I know they won't have the same last name...crud.
aggiebud wrote:
Woof wrote:I also thought that the J board was the hardest of the TOC (including tonight's DJ board) with lots of neg bait. A fair amount of Lach Trash for me on the Order cat (Primates and Rodents TSs? Really?). I also felt that Jay may have hurt himself with the DD hunting. No hope on FJ beyond knowing which answers were wrong. :(
I think we were all gun-shy at the category to even try to pull the trigger on Primates or Rodents. I know I was gun-shy on Patton, even though I was pretty sure that was right.
I was thinking Patton pretty hard, but he sure didn't look a whit like George C. Scott. :D

Expected: I swept European Geography.
Unexpected: I swept the Booker Prize. (WTF??!)

And in the foresight fail category, guess what I still have, unwatched, on my DVR. (Hint: Think J! round...)
Spoiler
Show
The 2011 Emmy Awards...
Yeah... serves me right for taking too long to get to it.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by DadofTwins » Fri Nov 11, 2011 11:31 am

Here's hoping the writing tonight lives up to the talent of the players on stage.

But after last night's game, I have my doubts.

When you're writing tough material for really good players, the goal is to give them a chance to shine while separating the merely awesome from the Immortals (and sometimes, as tonight, Immortals from one another). The best players deserve more than the hardest material; they deserve the best material.

Buddy deserves the congratulations he's getting for navigating that fire swamp of a board, but nobody deserves to have their fate decided there. The writers should be embarrassed, and may even owe Kara and Jay an apology, for subjecting good players to such awful, awful writing.

This is the TOC. The players know they have to step their game up. The writers do, too.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Fishercat » Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:00 pm

DoT: I trust you and StevenH on these matters, so could you explain to me (in all seriousness, I am missing something) what precisely made the writing on last night's boards terrible to that extent? I just don't get it.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by happybooker » Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:07 pm

goforthetie wrote: Are there more than 5 Vladimirs that are J! material? I suppose if one were extremely fast and good (or just decided not to pay attention while the other DJ categories were being played) one may have been able to pre-call all five clues in that category.
Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov is more widely known by this pseudonymous surname.

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by cheezguyty » Fri Nov 11, 2011 1:17 pm

Fishercat wrote:I just don't get it.
Me neither. I thought this game's boards were by far the easiest of the tournament and probably the most well-written. I can see how somone could be expected to get just about every clue, and I rarely feel that way. Maybe the contestants weren't enjoying the boards but I sure was!

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Re: Thursday, November 10, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by goforthetie » Fri Nov 11, 2011 2:08 pm

happybooker wrote:
goforthetie wrote: Are there more than 5 Vladimirs that are J! material? I suppose if one were extremely fast and good (or just decided not to pay attention while the other DJ categories were being played) one may have been able to pre-call all five clues in that category.
Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov is more widely known by this pseudonymous surname.
*headslap*

Clearly I am not extremely fast or good. Should have thought of Guerrero, too...

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