12/7/2005 game on GSN today

[legendneverdies]

http://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=651 Here's a game worth discussing possibly, though it was talked about six years ago on the Sony J! boards no doubt. GSN aired it today. Imagine some people here would have won it on the triple stumpers alone.

[dmleach]

James Quintong is a friend of mine, as it happens. We know each other through quizbowl and he lived in Atlanta at the time. I went to his viewing party at a local sports bar the evening this aired. None of us could believe how crazy tough this game was, and how low his locked out score was at the end of the game.

[heisman65]

All of those Season 22 games are craaaaazy hard. Just ask Rex Kramer, a.k.a. Bill McDonald, or read his posting about it on another thread on this board. You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was. My Coryats usually are in the $30,000 to $32,000 range, and my average for this season is close to $25,0000. Brutal!

[seaborgium]

You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was.

After the 2004 ToC, Ken Jennings won 26 games, the UToC lasted 76, and David Madden won 19. I haven't compared the qualifying periods of the ToCs, but I have to think that 121 games not occupied by a megatournament or a megachamp would have helped knock a bunch of three-timers off the bottom rungs, regardless of difficulty.

[legendneverdies]

You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was.

After the 2004 ToC, Ken Jennings won 26 games, the UToC lasted 76, and David Madden won 19. I haven't compared the qualifying periods of the ToCs, but I have to think that 121 games not occupied by a megatournament or a megachamp would have helped knock a bunch of three-timers off the bottom rungs, regardless of difficulty.

THe 2004 TofC aired in between KJ games 48 and 49(9/20-10/1/04). As per J-archive, game 49 of KJ was the first taped after the SUmmer hiatus. NOt sure when in 2004 the TofC taped, or whether it was before or after Ken's loss which taped in September(I think early in September the KJ loss was taped). The TofC qualifying period was from KJ's loss(12/1/2004) to probably late April 2006(next TofC in May 2006).

[slam]

All of those Season 22 games are craaaaazy hard. Just ask Rex Kramer, a.k.a. Bill McDonald, or read his posting about it on another thread on this board. You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was. My Coryats usually are in the $30,000 to $32,000 range, and my average for this season is close to $25,0000. Brutal!

Although I'm not disputing the belief that Season 22 was a tough season, I'm not sure I follow the logic in deducing that it was difficult from the dearth of multiple game champions. I would think that if the clues were tougher than most than their would be fewer "buzzer race" games. And that would mean that more knowledgeable players would be less likely to get outbuzzed by somewhat less knowledgeable players. So, a strong player could more easily put together a string of victories.

By the way, another three-time winner that season made it to the ToC final and actually won it. He still hangs out around here, so we don't want him to feel slighted.

[seaborgium]

You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was.

After the 2004 ToC, Ken Jennings won 26 games, the UToC lasted 76, and David Madden won 19. I haven't compared the qualifying periods of the ToCs, but I have to think that 121 games not occupied by a megatournament or a megachamp would have helped knock a bunch of three-timers off the bottom rungs, regardless of difficulty.

However you slice it, that's still Ken's run eating up 26 games.

[heisman65]

All good points. And, of course, I don't mean any disrespect to any TOC champ or participant, no matter how many games they won to get there. I was just noticing that other than a few huge exceptions, it seems that the level of difficulty of these boards sinks good contestant after good contestant, many before they can get past their third or fourth win. And the dollar amounts when they do win don't seem as large either. Maybe I'm wrong again, but these are the impressions I have after watching the majority of Season 22.

[teapot37]

You know it was a tough season when a three-time winner, Vik Vaz, made it to the TOC. Granted he did make it to the finals, but still, the dearth of four-time (or better) winners points to how hard this season was.

After the 2004 ToC, Ken Jennings won 26 games, the UToC lasted 76, and David Madden won 19. I haven't compared the qualifying periods of the ToCs, but I have to think that 121 games not occupied by a megatournament or a megachamp would have helped knock a bunch of three-timers off the bottom rungs, regardless of difficulty.

THe 2004 TofC aired in between KJ games 48 and 49(9/20-10/1/04). As per J-archive, game 49 of KJ was the first taped after the SUmmer hiatus. NOt sure when in 2004 the TofC taped, or whether it was before or after Ken's loss which taped in September(I think early in September the KJ loss was taped). The TofC qualifying period was from KJ's loss(12/1/2004) to probably late April 2006(next TofC in May 2006).

The 2004 ToC taped at the end of April of that year. If I remember correctly, they were the last games taped before the crew's hiatus.

[legendneverdies]

The 2004 ToC taped at the end of April of that year. If I remember correctly, they were the last games taped before the crew's hiatus.

Wonder if they were originally planning on airing the TofC when they did, outside of sweeps(9/20-10/1/2004). I know season 21 was to start with the Kids' week, and Alex even mentioned it on the last week of season 20 that Kids' week would start season 21. Kenjen probably pushed the Kids week to 10/18-10/22/2004. As an another aside: GSN's Lingo was airing new episodes at 7PM at the time, and aired the finals of their only Tournament of Champions on the day of the J!season 21 premiere opposite KJ game 39 in many cities.

[Budphrey]

My recollection is that Season 22 started off pretty darn difficult. I was wondering if the writers were using up a bunch of spare boards from the UToC. Then it seemed to normalize after a few weeks.

I don't know if that accounts for the paucity of 4-game and more winners in the 2006 Tournament of Champions cycle. For certain, though, there was more at work than just the relatively small number of regular games, even if it was only chance. By my count, there were two extraordinarily long stretches between four-plus-game winners in that cycle: 40 regular games between Kerry Breitenbach's last appearance and David Madden's first, and a whopping 52 games between Kevin Marshall's last appearance and Bob Mesko's fourth win (or alternatively, 46 games between Mesko's third and fourth wins). In a few minutes' research on complete seasons available on the J! Archive, I have only seen one other ToC cycle with two comparable droughts (1998).

[MarkBarrett]

You won't get any argument from me that the start of season 22 was harder. I blamed it on Mr. Madden. UTOC leftovers work as well. Either way I can't complain about being so fortunate to get to play twice.

[QBall]

Given this was my game, yes I can say that this board (and many of the boards) in the early part of the season were way hard. Heck, Alex even said to us in that small talk during the closing credits how hard that board was. I always chalked it up to the UTOC leftovers myself (didn't think about the Madden effect), and even a got a little warning from others playing earlier in that season, it was going to be that way for a little bit. What's interesting is that I noticed in future games that they actually created easier/more gettable clues for some the same categories/topics included in this episode, so I suppose the difficulty rating got ratcheted up for a while.