Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion [SPOILERS]

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Bob78164
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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Bob78164 »

Samer wrote:Since alietr said no spoiler tags are necessary . . . :)

How often has it been that all three contestants knew the right answer, but only one of them has gotten it right?
Not clear that's true in this case. I had no idea and simply guessed "first world" to have something down that fit the category. --Bob

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goforthetie
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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by goforthetie »

HugoZ wrote: Interesting article here, especially if you're a taxonomy groupie (Carl Linnaeus! He's soooo dreamy!).
What was a German biologist doing writing an opinion piece for the Indianapolis Star??

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by HugoZ »

goforthetie wrote:
HugoZ wrote: Interesting article here, especially if you're a taxonomy groupie (Carl Linnaeus! He's soooo dreamy!).
What was a German biologist doing writing an opinion piece for the Indianapolis Star??
I can't find anything about the opinion piece aside from what is in Wikipedia. Some of the citations state that Haeckel was "quoted" in the opinion piece, so he may not be the author of the op-ed.

If anyone has access to NewspaperArchive.com, the 9/20/14 issue of the Indianapolis Star is in there.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by dhkendall »

Samer wrote:How often has it been that all three contestants knew the right answer, but only one of them has gotten it right?
As a few have said before, I don't think WIlliam's response was a reference to the war of 1914-1918, but rather a reference to "the first world" as a term for the developed nations of the world (as opposed to the "second world" (mainly Communist (before the fall of the Berlin Wall) countries) and the "third world" (developing countries). I've found myself idly wondering how often these terms are used now, I can't remember hearing the term "second world" much even before 1990 (the only way I remember it was being taught of the "three worlds" in school), and absolutely not since - "first" and "third" worlds do seem to still get some airplay lately (despite the meaning lost with the demise of the "second world" (at least in the pre-1990 sense) but not as much, more "developed" and "developing" worlds.

Anyways, instaget FJ for me, the entire fact, including the name of the paper and the year, has stuck in my head as the first recorded instance of the phrase.
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BigDaddyJ
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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by BigDaddyJ »

MarkBarrett wrote:First I wondered if the Indy paper was a hint. That did nothing.
Being a lifelong resident of Indianapolis, I initially wondered if the clue had something to do with the first running of the Indianapolis 500, which was only a few years earlier in 1911. (Anyone in Indy who didn't already know that fact should know it now due to all of the hundred-year anniversary marketing surrounding the 2011 race.) I couldn't come up with anything along those lines that made sense so I dismissed the Indianapolis part of the clue as being extraneous information.

I next briefly considered "First Lady" (like alietr, I knew that phrase had taken some time to emerge), but felt sure that they wouldn't use that in a game with "First Ladies" as a category. Is it a reasonable criterion that the correct FJ response generally isn't something explicity mentioned earlier in the game? There may be counterexamples.

Nevertheless, after thinking some more about the year, I got to "First World War" with plenty of time left.

ETA:
seaborgium wrote:I suppose she was offering a tie, in a way, to William. (Either that, or she was just counting on William to be wrong, or she made a mistake reading the scores, or...) Sort of dangerous, since wagers to cover don't always end in 01.
An interesting thought. Has there ever been a game where the pre-FJ leader and the pre-FJ 2nd both bet to cover 3rd by a dollar and ended up tying?

As it turns out with the actual wagers made by William and Drew, Nicole sacrificed two possible wins from the game outcome matrix (RRR and RRW) that she would have had with the traditional cover bet, and she gained nothing from the exchange - i.e. she doesn't pick up the triple stumper or any other game outcomes.
Last edited by BigDaddyJ on Sat Dec 10, 2011 8:49 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Bamaman »

Drew: $12,800 + $6,400 = $19,200 (What is the 'First' World War?) (New champion: $19,200)
William: $15,200 - $15,200 = $0 (What is the first world?) (3rd place: $1,000)
Nicole: $15,800 - $9,801 = $5,999 (What is World War I?) (2nd place: $2,000)
It looks like Nicole was trying to shuit out third. So she either didn't notice William's score or was just counting on him missing. Between that and her DD wager, her lsoing out on her misphrasing didn't bother me.

I didn't like cancelled either, partly because I was expecting a TV show category.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Snaxx »

MarkBarrett wrote: First I wondered if the Indy paper was a hint. That did nothing.
I first said "The War to End All Wars." The Indy paper clue made me realize I was wrong, since I remembered the phrase originated in Europe. I then considered "World War" but not adding the "First."

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by AlphaDummy »

DWS wrote:FJ was an instaget for me (based on "first" and the date) and I didn't think it was misleading at all. Imagine that nuclear war broke out tomorrow. One could certainly call it the "first nuclear war" because we haven't had one before. As for the incorrect responses, it is unclear whether William forgot to include "war" in his response or meant for it just to be "first world." As for Nicole, she simply blew it by not paying enough attention to the category title. Kind of a disappointing end to the game.
Maybe William followed the same line of thought that I did, but just ran out of time? "Hmm...'First' in quotes...Too early for 'first world war' as there was no WWII yet...First Ladies? No...'1914' is a gift, you idiot...and 'opinion' seals it...go 'First World War'!" (For the record, I got it in enough time to write it down. At least I think I did...)

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by vellore »

I always assume that every element in an FJ clue is relevant, and so found it impossible to ignore Indianapolis. As a result, tried to think of racing terms involving "First," and could only come up with the lame "First Past the Post." Ugh.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by TheGrandPiano »

I was very happy to see Drew win the game. His first round went poorly (less than $1,000), but he changed his buzzer technique (crossed his arms) and, at least in terms of score (maybe even coryat) had the best Double Jeopardy Round of the three. If his first round had been like that, he would have taken the lead. Contrary to a one-and-done champion, I think he will win at least another game or two. He really played to win in the second half.

As messyjesse explained, I, too, have no understanding of Nicole's second Daily Double wager. It could very well have cost her the lead (though, of course, it didn't). This is a game where it shows how key reading and understanding the category is.

Go Drew! :D

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by John Boy »

heelsrule1988 wrote:Once again, another misleading FJ. I didn't think "First World War" would have been used until after the second World War.
I'm not sure it's fair to call this "misleading." I AM with you in thinking that we call WWI was called "The Great War" until WWII started, and it was retroactively named WWI. Certainly never heard of it being called WWI while it was still going on.

However, it apparently was, at least the one published time noted in the clue.

But I had no good alternate guess, and the date of the quote certainly suggested the war, so I was able to write that down as my guess, and if I had been Watson, I would have included a confidence level of about 10%.
Last edited by John Boy on Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by John Boy »

xxaaaxx wrote:Instaget FJ, though I spent a few seconds afterward convincing myself that I hadn't missed anything obvious.

I found Nicole's wager quite amusing. Sure, she would've won if she had remembered the category, but has she ever watched this show before? What on Earth made her think a 2nd place player would bet conservatively enough to risk not covering him?
Rather than "amusing," I found her wager incomprehensible and frustrating. I'll say it again (IMHO only, but it is my opinion) that (after a Clavin) the worst mistake you can make in J! is to lead going into FJ and not wager enough to win over a doubling bet by 2nd-place . Of course Nicole made it moot by booting FJ. Wagering by the actual contestants continues to be pretty bad.

And as for her actual response, the word "first" didn't need to be in the clue, since it was in the name of the category. How many times have we seen such categories? If the cat is "Red," White," and "Blue," then we know each correct answer must include one or more of those words. Alex usually reminds contestants of that when such categories show up, and I can recall a CC giving the same warning to a bunch of us playing a mock game in an audition. Contestants are supposed to know such stuff. Nicole's mess-up is entirely on her for not knowing it.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by jpahk »

great game to watch, but wow, what a clusterf*** FJ. #firstworldwarproblems

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by harrumph »

To keep myself primed for FJ I should research the earliest references to the third world war.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by jeff6286 »

Has anyone else noticed that we had three full weeks worth of shows where the player leading entering Final Jeopardy! emerged with the win? The first two shows after the TOC, 11/16 and 11/17, were won by Ellen from 3rd place and Glenn from 2nd, but the following 15 shows were won by the leader. The leader missed FJ just 3 times in those 15 shows, but still won all 3 thanks to what were, in my opinion, poor wagers by the 2nd place player. Tony overwagered from 2nd on 12/8, James underwagered from 2nd on 11/28, and on 11/22, Abby and Peter (maybe one, maybe both) overwagered to lose on a triple stumper.

Congratulations to Drew on finally putting an end to this remarkable streak. He even made a savvy enough wager that if FJ! had been a triple stumper, he still would have emerged victorious, even with Nicole betting less than most of us (and probably Drew) expected.

For anyone that has followed the show closely for a long time, have you ever noticed or discussed any streaks similar to this one?

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by OrangeSAM »

dhkendall wrote:... and the "third world" (developed countries).
Psst, that should be "developing countries".

Instaget FJ! here too. Five out five this week! :mrgreen:
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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by goforthetie »

jeff6286 wrote:Has anyone else noticed that we had three full weeks worth of shows where the player leading entering Final Jeopardy! emerged with the win? The first two shows after the TOC, 11/16 and 11/17, were won by Ellen from 3rd place and Glenn from 2nd, but the following 15 shows were won by the leader. The leader missed FJ just 3 times in those 15 shows, but still won all 3 thanks to what were, in my opinion, poor wagers by the 2nd place player. Tony overwagered from 2nd on 12/8, James underwagered from 2nd on 11/28, and on 11/22, Abby and Peter (maybe one, maybe both) overwagered to lose on a triple stumper.

Congratulations to Drew on finally putting an end to this remarkable streak. He even made a savvy enough wager that if FJ! had been a triple stumper, he still would have emerged victorious, even with Nicole betting less than most of us (and probably Drew) expected.

For anyone that has followed the show closely for a long time, have you ever noticed or discussed any streaks similar to this one?
I'd be willing to wager that there was a streak at least as long some time in 2004. (Embedded in a longer and more notable streak of a different sort, of course...)

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by dhkendall »

OrangeSAM wrote:
dhkendall wrote:... and the "third world" (developed countries).
Psst, that should be "developing countries".
Oops, fingers not listening to brain. Fixed.
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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by opusthepenguin »

dhkendall wrote:
OrangeSAM wrote:
dhkendall wrote:... and the "third world" (developed countries).
Psst, that should be "developing countries".
Oops, fingers not listening to brain. Fixed.
Dude, if you know how to fix that, please tell me. I'm bagging you. Eye knead two no.

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Re: Friday, December 9, 2011 Game Recap & Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Paucle »

opusthepenguin wrote:Dude, if you know how to fix that, please tell me. I'm bagging you. Eye knead two no.
You can't edit your posts? Or am I misinterpreting your question?
(Unless you're asking how he does it without it showing up as an addendum, which case step one is probably "be a moderator") ;)

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