The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

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Bamaman
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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Bamaman » Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:21 pm

dhkendall wrote:I wonder what Fleming era winners think of the fact that the total winnings of a five time champ and a TOC winner can now be had in a couple of clues? (And that people who lose their only game take home more than multiday winners in their time)
How do you feel that everything cost a lot less back then?

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Magna » Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:35 am

Bamaman wrote:How do you feel that everything cost a lot less back then?
Not to mention that the whole world was monochrome.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Sat Oct 10, 2015 3:15 pm

Jeopardy! was always in color. If you only had a black and white set in 1964, that was your own fault!

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by alietr » Sat Oct 10, 2015 5:28 pm

Robert K S wrote:Jeopardy! was always in color. If you only had a black and white set in 1964, that was your own fault!
Not many of us did.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by dhkendall » Sat Oct 10, 2015 6:52 pm

alietr wrote:
Robert K S wrote:Jeopardy! was always in color. If you only had a black and white set in 1964, that was your own fault!
Not many of us did.
My mom probably did, growing up her dad repaired TVs. In the early 50s they were the first family in their community to get TV, all the kids would go over to her house to watch the American shows (there were no Canadian broadcasters in Winnipeg yet) that they got from mounting a large antenna to a huge pole in their backyard to reach TV from Grand Forks and Fargo. (When I was a kid, my grandparents still had that large pole in their yard, although it had outlived its purpose of providing TV reception, it was just something for their berry vines to crawl up now.) I'm sure that they were early adopters of colour TV (although 1964 was the year before my parents got married, so she wouldn't have been at home for long after.)
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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by MinnesotaMyron » Wed Aug 10, 2016 10:28 pm

Robert K S wrote:
1969 Tournament of Champions - sixth annual

[Winner and winnings indeterminable, though Jay Wolpert, who became a game show producer and feature film screenwriter, is cited as having won this tournament in Maxene Fabe's 1979 TV Game Shows book. Dr. Elliot Shteir later became the 1st runner-up ($10,000) in the Trebek era's 1995 Seniors Tournament in July, 1995, losing to Aaron Klein.]
In the interview portion of the first game of the 1995 Senior's Tournament finals, Elliot Shteir indicates that he came in second in that tournament. Alex also mentions that he is the oldest player "ever to play" Jeopardy. He was born September 25, 1921 (see this likely obituary), which would mean he was roughly 73 and a half years old at the time these shows taped/aired. I wonder if anyone who played the 12th season Seniors Tournament (or any later regular season game for that matter) was older?

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by floridagator » Sat Aug 13, 2016 11:39 am

Robert K S wrote:1964 Tournament of Champions - first annual

#408, recorded in Studio 6A 1965-10-05, aired 1965-10-20
  • Mr. Bob Law, a retired service man from Brooklyn, New York, winner of $3,400
  • Miss Carolyn Benson, a literary researcher from New York City, winner of $3,855
  • Mr. Earle Codrington, a stripper from New York City, winner of $2,010
I assume Mr. Codrington removed paint?
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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Fleeboy » Sun Aug 14, 2016 12:04 pm

I've wondered why the name of Fleming-era 5xer (and future congressman and Watson foe) Rush Holt doesn't appear in these records.

Either he played in the pre-empted second semifinal in 1974, taped and won his five games in the two months before the series was canceled in January 1975, was unable to participate in a ToC for some reason, or 5xers weren't guaranteed invitations to the tournament.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:52 pm

Fleeboy wrote:Either he played in the pre-empted second semifinal in 1974, taped and won his five games in the two months before the series was canceled in January 1975, was unable to participate in a ToC for some reason, or 5xers weren't guaranteed invitations to the tournament.
I hesitate to mention the omitted possibility.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by alietr » Sun Aug 14, 2016 8:12 pm

Robert K S wrote:
Fleeboy wrote:Either he played in the pre-empted second semifinal in 1974, taped and won his five games in the two months before the series was canceled in January 1975, was unable to participate in a ToC for some reason, or 5xers weren't guaranteed invitations to the tournament.
I hesitate to mention the omitted possibility.
This guy? http://www.cbsnews.com/news/rep-rush-ho ... challenge/

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Fleeboy » Mon Aug 15, 2016 11:08 am

alietr wrote:
Robert K S wrote:
Fleeboy wrote:Either he played in the pre-empted second semifinal in 1974, taped and won his five games in the two months before the series was canceled in January 1975, was unable to participate in a ToC for some reason, or 5xers weren't guaranteed invitations to the tournament.
I hesitate to mention the omitted possibility.
This guy? http://www.cbsnews.com/news/rep-rush-ho ... challenge/
Yep, that guy.

Robert, I forgot that Holt could have played in the 1978-79 season. Is there anything else I overlooked?

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Mon Aug 15, 2016 10:50 pm

Fleeboy wrote:Robert, I forgot that Holt could have played in the 1978-79 season. Is there anything else I overlooked?
I am skeptical by nature. I didn't take it for granted that Hutton Gibson was a 5-time champ and ToC winner until I went to the Library of Congress and proved it for myself. I still wonder about Paul Curry. I don't think I ever saw Rush Holt's name while going through those records. That might not mean anything. But if there's anybody worth questioning over a resume boast, it's our elected leaders.

According to this article, he was on the show "soon after college." If we take that to mean after his undergrad (circa 1970), that rules out a late-'70s appearance, but then again, he was "in college" for basically that whole decade.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Fleeboy » Tue Aug 16, 2016 10:16 am

Robert K S wrote:
I don't think I ever saw Rush Holt's name while going through those records. That might not mean anything. But if there's anybody worth questioning over a resume boast, it's our elected leaders.
I had considered that possibility, but gave Holt the benefit of the doubt.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:29 pm

Still trying to figure out who won the 1967 ToC. We know from her obit that it wasn't Eleanor Endsley. This is a probable obit for Harry Murtha, but it doesn't mention Jeopardy! If this is the Anne Fried (the facts more or less match up), she left the U.S. for Finland after appearing on the show and died in 1998.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Roadgeek Adam » Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:33 pm

I can solve something. In the 1970 tournament, we had a tie. Also, M. McNeil is Mary McNeil of Lansdale, Pennsylvania.

For the 1973 TOC, a trip to Greece is offered.
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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by seaborgium » Wed Mar 06, 2019 7:09 pm

So Mary Lee Fox won SF1 (beating Russ Poylo), Barbara Franco won SF2, and then Gene Cheatam and Dolores Henderson tied SF3, so they decided on the fly to reduce the final to one game with doubled clue values, and use what would have been the first game of the finals to instead have Gene and Dolores rematch, with highest-scoring non-winner Russ filling out the ranks. (Then Gene apparently won that game and the final.)

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Wed Mar 06, 2019 11:48 pm

Roadgeek Adam wrote:
Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:33 pm
I can solve something. In the 1970 tournament, we had a tie. Also, M. McNeil is Mary McNeil of Lansdale, Pennsylvania.
Great work! I've added your information in above.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Roadgeek Adam » Thu Mar 07, 2019 12:18 am

No problem.

I spent the better part of two hours doing research in every database I access. I found lots of various articles, but I could never get a few things such as the winner you're still looking for in 1967.

I have several articles that notes where players are from as well.
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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Robert K S » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:27 am

Feel free to post the hometowns.

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Re: The Tournament of Champions in the Art Fleming era of Jeopardy!

Post by Roadgeek Adam » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:38 am

1972:
Image

1969:

Image

1971:

Image
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