Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

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JoshuaKreitzer
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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by JoshuaKreitzer » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:21 am

reddpen wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:35 am

Two misses, both in J: Socrates and Plato for Plato and Aristotle, and Cleopatra for Nefertiti. The latter especially feels like 50/50/90 to me given how little I know about either woman. Any handy way to distinguish them?
What's 50/50/90? Anyway, the hint for me was that the clue began "As queen of Egypt in the 1300s B.C. ...." The famous Cleopatra, the one who has had plays and movies written about her, was the one who had an affair with Julius Caesar, who lived in the 1st century BCE. So that rules out Cleopatra for this question, and rules in the most famous other queen of Egypt.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by seaborgium » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:43 am

JoshuaKreitzer wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:21 am
reddpen wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:35 am

Two misses, both in J: Socrates and Plato for Plato and Aristotle, and Cleopatra for Nefertiti. The latter especially feels like 50/50/90 to me given how little I know about either woman. Any handy way to distinguish them?
What's 50/50/90? Anyway, the hint for me was that the clue began "As queen of Egypt in the 1300s B.C. ...." The famous Cleopatra, the one who has had plays and movies written about her, was the one who had an affair with Julius Caesar, who lived in the 1st century BCE. So that rules out Cleopatra for this question, and rules in the most famous other queen of Egypt.
And although that Cleopatra was the VII, the I's reign began less than 150 years earlier.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Peter the accountant » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:06 am

reddpen wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:35 am
... Cleopatra for Nefertiti. The latter especially feels like 50/50/90 to me given how little I know about either woman. Any handy way to distinguish them?
I use dates.

Cleopatra: just barely BC (born 69 BC, died 30 BC, but I had to look up those dates). Married to Mark Antony. For me, she's "old" Egypt rather than "ancient". Movie made about her (think Elizabeth Taylor and Richard Burton) and a play (Shakespeare). Had dealings with Roman empire, specifically one of the Ceasars. More of a civil leader rather than religious (my impression, anyway - probably not exactly correct). WAS a pharaoh.

Nefertiti: way BC (looked her up as dying 1331 BC). Ancient Egypt, with Pharaohs and hieroglyphics and pyramids and such. More into Egyptian gods than Cleopatra. Never Pharaoh, just married to one.

My hook is alphabetic: dates BC are backwards, just like their names are alphabetically.
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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Peter the accountant » Tue Nov 14, 2017 4:09 am

JoshuaKreitzer wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:21 am
What's 50/50/90?
Under pressure, a 50/50 guess is wrong 90% of the time. :D
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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by CasketRomance » Tue Nov 14, 2017 7:39 am

Kenny wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:15 am
CasketRomance wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 10:54 pm
Kenny wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:30 pm
You could've spotted me Robert Browning poem, children's story and German village and I still wouldn't have come up with Hannibal Hamlin. Had completely forgotten he was Lincoln's first VP.

Glad to see Austin move on. He's my favorite contestant this season. Was shocked that, on her DD, Lily seemed to instaget circumference then blurted out "radius." But she was the only one who missed FJ, so it ended up not costing her the game.
totally forgot about him...only thing i know about him is he is the only vice president to have died on the 4th july
Only VP who did not become president. John Adams and Thomas Jefferson both were Vice Presidents and both died on July 4. In fact, they died on the same date.
yeah that is what i meant...when i think of adams and jefferson i don't think of vice president, though they served as such before becoming president

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Wheatley » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:24 am

NHO Hamlin, but fair game on them for asking for a VP of the most famous presidents in history.
goatman wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:27 pm
Unlike many fans I really don't appreciate Austin's 'clever' repartee and his odd gestures. IMHO it's an intimidation tactic designed to distract fellow contestants. It's apparent that he won tonite because the challengers let him get away with it. Stop guessing! :oops:
I think Lily and Andrew would be very offended if you told them they lost because they were intimidated/distracted, rather than because Austin played a better game.
Coryats calculator, share and enjoy. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by John Boy » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:57 am

Did not know that this was Austin's first win w/o a DD, as I read above, but in retrospect I'm not at all surprised if that is true.

In his regular season games DDs killed a lot of his opponents because he landed on them and really capitalized on them. Here it killed them because THEY landed on them and, uh, did not. "Radius" for "circumference" will probably be one that wakes Lilly in cold sweats and anguished screams for years to come.

Picked up LT for magnet school, (top of) the world, and (my proud moment of the game) mendicants.

In FJ I paused briefly at Van Buren before mercifully thinking of The Pied Piper and landing on Hamlin with plenty of time to spare.

Congrats to all three on doing well with a tough game.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by hbomb1947 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:27 am

OntarioQuizzer wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:26 pm
Golf wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:40 pm
Lily should have been in the lead going into FJ had she taken her time and found the correct words for her DD. Not that it would have mattered.

Wasn't thrilled about Andrew's DJ DD wager in the bottom box. He started in row 3 and knew it, then didn't know row 4 before the DD. That should have been a warning bell, if he gets row 4 I like the wager without question. And let's face it, a $2k clue in the ToC isn't going to be easy. There was lots of time and dollars left on the board if he missed, but I can't help but wonder if this wasn't the time for a $5 wager. But perhaps he was trying to put the game away right then and there. I guess in the end that making an error on the aggressive side is almost always better than making an error on the passive side.
Look at it this way:

Remember, Andrew was in the Friday game. He was sequestered and did not see Austin's QF. All Andrew knows is that Austin's a 12-time champ having won 400K+. (read: juggernaut).

If you're up against a Ken Jennings type, in a good category for you, on a Daily Double, up 12000 to 6800, do you not go for the jugular, too?
But Austin isn't a Ken Jennings type, and I don't think his play to that point in the game would have led Andrew to regard him with fear, notwithstanding his regular-play stats -- especially given how dominant Andrew was in his own QF game. (And Andrew would have known that Austin hadn't won his QF match and was a wild card.) Andrew was just trying to lock up the game against a good but not Jennings-y TOC semifinalist, but I feel it was a bad gamble given the clue placement, the fact that Andrew had clammed on the $1,600 clue in the category, and the size of the lead that Andrew already had. Besides, the game situation didn't require a desperation move like when Roger had to make his big DD wager against Brad and Ken in the BOTD. If it was like a $1,200 or maybe even $1,600 clue, then by all means, go big at that point. Otherwise, I think the better play is to bet small and then aggressively hunt for the other DD.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Volante » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:44 am

jeff6286 wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:21 am
reddpen wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:35 am
and Cleopatra for Nefertiti. The latter especially feels like 50/50/90 to me given how little I know about either woman. Any handy way to distinguish them?
Given the date in this clue, it should have been a slam dunk. I assume you know that Julius Caesar and Mark Antony weren't around in the 1300s B.C.
I couldn't decide between Nefertiti or Nefertari...

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:11 am

Haven't had time to look through this thread yet so I'm sure this has already been said, but that Kimpala DD was brutal. That would have been better suited as a FJ clue (but even then it would have been tough). Tough break for Andrew who certainly seemed like a contender to win the tournament.

Hamlin was actually my FJ precall, but it still took me a few seconds to piece it together.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by boson » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:51 am

If I was one of the contestants yesterday, and the FJ category of "Vice Presidents" came up, I would likely have an involuntary gasp and freak-out. This is likely my least favourite category, and the one where my opponents would have the largest advantage over me. Why Americans like knowing facts about their presidents/veeps to this depth is something I have never understood (presidential trivia seems to go even deeper than British royalty or Papal trivia).

However, the German folktale got me to Hamlin, and it sounded familiar (though I couldn't have named the president for whom he served). If I had been up there, I likely would have hoped to win on a triple stumper... and lost.

That was a great game. Andrew lost only on a truly diabolical DD. I'd love to see the Impala question polled at the end of the week. Lilly's few negs (DD and "Lost Things") kept her from being in contention (though of course the missed final made those moot).

I think, following Andy Saunders' metric from the Jeopardy Fan page, that 12-14 times out of 20 Andrew wins the match between these three. Bad luck to him, great game play by Austin to secure the final spot.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:02 am

Lefty wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:58 pm

Didn't watch, but I'm guessing Alex's hesitancy on "Blues" is because he only knows three or four NHL teams, and he thought maybe Blues was the short form for Blue Jackets.
If you only know three or four NHL teams it seems unlikely the Blue Jackets would be one of them, but maybe.

I agree with those that have said Austin got a possibly unfair second chance on this one.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Woppy T » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:18 am

This Is Kirk! wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:02 am
Lefty wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:58 pm

Didn't watch, but I'm guessing Alex's hesitancy on "Blues" is because he only knows three or four NHL teams, and he thought maybe Blues was the short form for Blue Jackets.
If you only know three or four NHL teams it seems unlikely the Blue Jackets would be one of them, but maybe.

I agree with those that have said Austin got a possibly unfair second chance on this one.
Alex is Canadian.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Lefty » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:19 am

This Is Kirk! wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:02 am

If you only know three or four NHL teams it seems unlikely the Blue Jackets would be one of them, but maybe.
Three or four plus the one on his card.
I'm smart and I want respect.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:20 am

Woppy T wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:18 am
This Is Kirk! wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:02 am
Lefty wrote:
Mon Nov 13, 2017 11:58 pm

Didn't watch, but I'm guessing Alex's hesitancy on "Blues" is because he only knows three or four NHL teams, and he thought maybe Blues was the short form for Blue Jackets.
If you only know three or four NHL teams it seems unlikely the Blue Jackets would be one of them, but maybe.

I agree with those that have said Austin got a possibly unfair second chance on this one.
Alex is Canadian.
Oh, I totally missed the "Alex" in there. I thought lefty was talking about Austin. Yes, I'm fairly confident Alex knows more than three or four NHL teams! :D

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by seaborgium » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:34 am

boson wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:51 am
Lilly's few negs (DD and "Lost Things") kept her from being in contention (though of course the missed final made those moot).
"Lost things" was a correct response by Lilly.


I don't think anyone in this thread has reported a get on Andrew's DD, so I will report that my dad got Kampala.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by boson » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:51 am

seaborgium wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:34 am
boson wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:51 am
Lilly's few negs (DD and "Lost Things") kept her from being in contention (though of course the missed final made those moot).
"Lost things" was a correct response by Lilly.
Oops. Thanks for the correction. I was looking at the game progress graph and missed which question was which.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by morbeedo » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:47 pm

seaborgium wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:34 am
I don't think anyone in this thread has reported a get on Andrew's DD, so I will report that my dad got Kampala.
I got it and didn't think it was that tough, but ok, the difficulty of any clue is gonna be subjective and maybe I'm a bit of an Afrophile. In any case, that animal name is pretty commonly known and it's really not that far a leap to the capital of Uganda - no need to cycle through all 50+ African capitals. I do worse when asked to name two things in a DD, like
SpoilerShow
countries with only A for vowels that touch both the Atlantic and Pacific, or state capitals with months of the year in their names...
Overall, I'm finding the difficulty of the TOC material on par with regular games. Nothing's really standing out to me as champion-level material. What do others think? Maybe I'm just becoming a better clue solver ;)

I'm neutral on Austin, but I think he lucked his way into the finals. But hey - luck is always gonna be a factor on Jeopardy! and it'll only take you so far.

That final QUEEN clue flew right by me. Who was that again?

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! » Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:55 pm

morbeedo wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:47 pm
seaborgium wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:34 am
I don't think anyone in this thread has reported a get on Andrew's DD, so I will report that my dad got Kampala.
I got it and didn't think it was that tough, but ok, the difficulty of any clue is gonna be subjective and maybe I'm a bit of an Afrophile. In any case, that animal name is pretty commonly known and it's really not that far a leap to the capital of Uganda - no need to cycle through all 50+ African capitals.
I think what made it difficult is there are many African ungulates. If you immediately recognized the photo as being an impala you've got a chance, but it's still not easy. If you don't think of impala quickly you're effectively screwed. Then you are mentally going through the African capitals trying to find one that sounds plausible.

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Re: Monday, November 13, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by morbeedo » Tue Nov 14, 2017 1:19 pm

This Is Kirk! wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:55 pm
morbeedo wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:47 pm
seaborgium wrote:
Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:34 am
I don't think anyone in this thread has reported a get on Andrew's DD, so I will report that my dad got Kampala.
I got it and didn't think it was that tough, but ok, the difficulty of any clue is gonna be subjective and maybe I'm a bit of an Afrophile. In any case, that animal name is pretty commonly known and it's really not that far a leap to the capital of Uganda - no need to cycle through all 50+ African capitals.
I think what made it difficult is there are many African ungulates. If you immediately recognized the photo as being an impala you've got a chance, but it's still not easy. If you don't think of impala quickly you're effectively screwed. Then you are mentally going through the African capitals trying to find one that sounds plausible.
Fair enough. I've missed enough DD and FJ to know that sometimes you're just never gonna get there. When I'm stumped, I try to remind myself to look for the obvious, because the writers aren't ever going for anything really obscure, generally speaking

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