Tuesday, November 21, 2017 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

[zerobandwidth]

My two cents: They should just do away with clues that don't allow much time for thinking. (If this was a regular clue, you'd still be given a correct response if you run out of time on the lights in front of you while you're giving your answer).

This is an important point. You're allowed to "finish talking" during regular play even if your last timing light goes out, but you're not allowed to "finish writing" at the end of FJ!. It could be argued that that is intentionally part of the unique challenge of FJ!, but with that, there has to be some consideration, when writing the clue, for the length of the acceptable answers. At least limit it to less than one character per second.

Also, it's time to do away with the light pens altogether. We have touchscreen-and-stylus technology. Sony makes tablets. Speaking as someone who almost reached for the emergency card because I couldn't convince the pen to work for a good 5 seconds, let's move on from the 1980s.

[John Boy]

He also made a smart FJ bet. Not sure what the others were thinking.

Easy. They were thinking "Pick a number. Any number. Any number at all. Yeah, that's a number. I'm good."

[John Boy]

I have a question that actually refers to Monday's game, but I forgot to ask it in the proper thread. I hope you'll indulge me for asking something that is off-topic in this thread.

I have been a Dallas Cowboys fan for over 50 years, including most of the time when Bob Lilly was playing. I actually lived in Dallas during the last 4 years or so of his career. And in all that time I can not remember once, EVER, hearing him referred to as "Tiger Lilly" as was reported in a clue on Monday's game.

Any of you familiar with that nickname?

[Bamaman]

His Wikipedia article called him Mr. Cowboy. But I saw this when I googled his name and Tiger Lilly.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... llBo00.htm

[This Is Kirk!]

The White Album was an intelligent guess, but the Wall, which came out in 1979?

Once I saw that, I thought to myself, rather horrified-like, "I...don't think The Wall is that old, Eric..."

So he was 12.5 years off, from a 50 year anniversary.
Considering Eric may not have been born when The Wall was released, I can give him credit for a nice guess. I'm thinking that album may be in the top ten of whatever survey hailed SPLHCB as the greatest of all time.

The Dark Side of the Moon would be the more likely Pink Floyd album, and it's a lot closer to being 50 years old (released in 1973).

[Golf]

Just a reminder that there are two surviving Beatles, either or both of whom might be lurking here, especially after the recent publicity. So let's refrain from trash talking their album, ok?

Oh man, this is gold. Many kudos.

[davey]

There was a PBS special on the 50th anniversary of Sgt. Pepper that aired a few months ago - the main reason I got this FJ.
An awful ending to the game. The argument that he added information not wrong to a common acceptable shorthand for the name is the best argument for bringing him back. Iffy that TPTB will see it that way.

[flemmingfan]

Add me to the list of dismayers for all the stated reasons. Let's start a petition, Bring Wilbur Back! BTW, Tiger Lily was new to me as well.

[Golf]

The FJ clue was pretty poor for requiring so many letters. That being said, unfortunately per the rules of the game Wilbur's response is incorrect. It's a title and titles have to be exact. "Gone with the" and "Silence of the" would not be acceptable Oscar winning films.

A picture of Qaddafi as a bottom row clue was a bit surprising.

Eric's TDD in the first round was nice to see, Kiana's DD wager was lacking, Wilbur's was acceptable, I wonder if the contestants had more clue than we did as to the amount of time left in the round.

With 8 clues on the FJ board and a DD remaining Wilbur went to the one clue that almost never holds a DD. (after the top row DD clue this year it's more difficult wording this strategic error. And I have to assume if I ever get the call there will magically be a DD in the first row and I'll never find it! )

[This Is Kirk!]

The FJ clue was pretty poor for requiring so many letters. That being said, unfortunately per the rules of the game Wilbur's response is incorrect. It's a title and titles have to be exact. "Gone with the" and "Silence of the" would not be acceptable Oscar winning films.

True, but it's not a hard and fast rule. For example they'll accept "Alice in Wonderland" even though there is no book named that.

[Elijah Baley]

The FJ clue was pretty poor for requiring so many letters. That being said, unfortunately per the rules of the game Wilbur's response is incorrect. It's a title and titles have to be exact. "Gone with the" and "Silence of the" would not be acceptable Oscar winning films.

A picture of Qaddafi as a bottom row clue was a bit surprising.

Eric's TDD in the first round was nice to see, Kiana's DD wager was lacking, Wilbur's was acceptable, I wonder if the contestants had more clue than we did as to the amount of time left in the round.

With 8 clues on the FJ board and a DD remaining Wilbur went to the one clue that almost never holds a DD. (after the top row DD clue this year it's more difficult wording this strategic error. And I have to assume if I ever get the call there will magically be a DD in the first row and I'll never find it! )

I think the distinction with your examples is that Sgt. Pepper and Sgt. Pepper's are well known and well used references for the longer name. Wilbur's response included the necessary information to correctly identify the album. Accordingly, there is a very good argument that it would be accepted.

A better example might be if the FJ response involved naming Rhode Island. The official name - as any fourth grader who has sat through civics in that state could tell you - is "State of Rhode Island and Providence Plantations." And yet Rhode Island is obviously commonly accepted and used. So had someone written "State of Rhode Island and Providence" when time expired, should they be given credit? I think most folks would say yes because the answer included a correct response and players aren't generally penalized for including "extraneous" information.

And as others have pointed out, it's really time to move past the light pen. And to get bigger monitors for players who can't see images in video clues as well as we can at home.

/rant

[Tencent]

The other thing of note is those pens for FJ are really substandard. Everyone on the show says they are tricky and do not work well.
It is high time that the show figure out and better way of recording. If the pens worked better, things like this would be less of a problem.

[This Is Kirk!]

Also, it's time to do away with the light pens altogether. We have touchscreen-and-stylus technology. Sony makes tablets. Speaking as someone who almost reached for the emergency card because I couldn't convince the pen to work for a good 5 seconds, let's move on from the 1980s.

That will have to wait till next season. They already blew this season's tech budget on the retractable podium dividers!

[John Boy]

The White Album was an intelligent guess, but the Wall, which came out in 1979?

Once I saw that, I thought to myself, rather horrified-like, "I...don't think The Wall is that old, Eric..."

So he was 12.5 years off, from a 50 year anniversary.
Considering Eric may not have been born when The Wall was released, I can give him credit for a nice guess. I'm thinking that album may be in the top ten of whatever survey hailed SPLHCB as the greatest of all time.

The Dark Side of the Moon would be the more likely Pink Floyd album, and it's a lot closer to being 50 years old (released in 1973).

Thank you for this. Dark Side of the Moon was my guess even though I knew it was probably a few years off. Good to know it wasn't more like two decades off.

[Volante]

The FJ clue was pretty poor for requiring so many letters. That being said, unfortunately per the rules of the game Wilbur's response is incorrect. It's a title and titles have to be exact. "Gone with the" and "Silence of the" would not be acceptable Oscar winning films.

True, but it's not a hard and fast rule. For example they'll accept "Alice in Wonderland" even though there is no book named that.

https://www.amazon.com/Alice-Wonderland ... 619490226/

Kiana also got the whole album title down in time, so it could be done; it's not like this was a triple stumper.

[Anachronism]

I have a question that actually refers to Monday's game, but I forgot to ask it in the proper thread. I hope you'll indulge me for asking something that is off-topic in this thread.

I have been a Dallas Cowboys fan for over 50 years, including most of the time when Bob Lilly was playing. I actually lived in Dallas during the last 4 years or so of his career. And in all that time I can not remember once, EVER, hearing him referred to as "Tiger Lilly" as was reported in a clue on Monday's game.

Any of you familiar with that nickname?

I'm fairly strong on the NFL, but not on Peter Pan. I had no idea - the wikipedia article suggests the Cowboys never used the nickname, but his college team did. It was one of those questions where the real question was unrelated to the category - name a Peter Pan character that would be an appropriate nickname for someone named Bob Lilly.

[badgerfellow]

Eric's TDD in the first round was nice to see, Kiana's DD wager was lacking, Wilbur's was acceptable, I wonder if the contestants had more clue than we did as to the amount of time left in the round.

Regarding knowing how much time is left: other than the "less than a minute" warning, there is no clock for the contestants that shows how much time is left. I know some on this forum have thought including a clock on the screen would help the audience, but given stoppages and editing, that would not be feasible.

I would bank on about 5-6 clues being said in that minute if editing doesn't happen or a daily double is not chosen.

[Peter the accountant]

Let's start with my stats first today.

R: 26 W: 3 costing 2600
FJ: Went with the White Album
LT: none today, in spite of the plethora of opportunities
Coryat: 16,800

Since it's been mentioned, I fell in the Pentateuch trap. Had to go back after the game was over and re-read the question. I completely missed the Hebrew word part of the clue. Then I let my confusion over that miss throw me off and cause me to not respond at all on the next clue or two. That's a game skill I need to work on. Immediately let the previous question go and focus on the next one.

On FJ!, I had no idea what would be "The Greatest Album of All Time" so I had to resort to other parts of the clue. 50 years ago takes us to 1967, which is the second half of The Beatles as a group. I don't know in what years their albums were released, so thought a moment or two and went with the White album. Didn't think of Sgt. Pepper.

FJ! wagering was interesting. Wilbur's wager matched my thinking - protected from a double by the 2nd place player (or players in this case). Being in a tie for 2nd is a really tough place to be. If you like the category, risking it all is probably the way to go. That keeps you from losing to the other tied player if you both get it right. However, wagering for a TS on final is a viable option. In that case, wagering zero is the way to go. So I would have expected Eric and Kiana to wager it all or nothing, depending on how they felt about the category.

Felt bad for Wilbur on the ruling against him, but rules is rules, even when you don't like them.

I'll also agree with the general dislike of the whole categories devoted to guest video clues. TPTB need to find a way to shorten those up. It was painful to see almost a whole category go un-revealed in DJ!. Until you consider the category itself. Perhaps avoiding a spelling category was a blessing in disguise? At any rate, the players (knowingly or unknowingly) handled that situation well, saving the video clues for last so the whole J! round board would be revealed. Then they got a bit lucky in having a category that they all could agree on to avoid in the DJ! round.

PS - I managed to run the 20/20 category, but I expect that I'm far from alone in that feat. The first three of those clues were very obtainable. (Who is this man who is obviously a Pope? What disease robs your memory? What illegal drug is an opioid?) The last two were a bit tougher, particularly recognizing a younger Muammar Gaddafi. I'm not surprised that Wilbur got that one. Being alive at the time of historical events gives you a bit of an advantage.

[MitchO]

Well, my son named after a Beatle recently had his Bar Mitzvah, so yeah, insta-get for the Torah and Sgt Pepper, and I even said to my girlfriend "Boy, that's a lot to write, I wonder if they'd accept just Sgt. Pepper?"

1967 is the Summer of Love, and Sgt Pepper is the centerpiece. '67 album should auto to Sgt Pepper.

[Category 13]

The White Album was an intelligent guess, but the Wall, which came out in 1979?

Once I saw that, I thought to myself, rather horrified-like, "I...don't think The Wall is that old, Eric..."

So he was 12.5 years off, from a 50 year anniversary.
Considering Eric may not have been born when The Wall was released, I can give him credit for a nice guess. I'm thinking that album may be in the top ten of whatever survey hailed SPLHCB as the greatest of all time.

The Dark Side of the Moon would be the more likely Pink Floyd album, and it's a lot closer to being 50 years old (released in 1973).

I completely forgot about that album. (can you tell I'm not into Floyd?)
I couldn't agree with you more.