Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

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BigDaddyMatty
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by BigDaddyMatty »

Coryat: 33,000
43 R/0 W
DD: 2/3
FJ: :mrgreen:
LT: drive drunk (DD); Norman Bates; Trojan War; "Tenderness"; Macaroni Club

This was the second day in a row where I was shocked FJ! wasn't a triple get, but the early returns here suggest that 2/3 is just about right.

Speaking of easy clues, Pangaea as a $2000 DD given supercontinent and "all Earth"?!

I'm glad Johanna gave the less offensive name of the Christie work.

NHO Grey Gardens, but the film's synopsis sounds familiar.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by jeff6286 »

Golf wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:00 pm
xxaaaxx wrote: Those wagers...woof. Not sure why I bothered calculating their optimal wagers, when I was pretty sure they'd just bet it all or close to it. Didn't see Michelle's wager coming though. If she hated the category, why bet anything, let alone enough to fall behind a double up by Wes (who shouldn't have doubled up but still)!?
Category 13 wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:44 pm If she suspected Johanna was a wagering guru, an $800 bet would have been the best non-cover wager for Michelle.
I think the nicest way I can put this is that none of them were wagering gurus.
I have no problem with Wes's wager. He can't win if second place makes what we would generally consider to be the optimal wager. So he can either hope second bets all/most of their money and bet less than $4800 to stay ahead of first on a miss, or he can bet it all and hope 2nd bets at least $1600. Historically, 2nd is probably more likely to bet all (or nearly all) than they are to bet something just between $1600 and $3200, but I can't blame him for wanting to add the most he can to narrow the gap on second and hope for the best.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by mfc248 »

My first instinct upon seeing the category was Roots, but thought it might be too obvious and pre-called Jaws instead - allowing me the double satisfaction a both a correct response and a correct "blind guess."

I'd like opinions on one of my responses from Double Jeopardy!. The clue:
Tell buyers all about the storage space in the scullery, aka this person's pantry
It went begging on the stage; Alex Michelle gave "butler" as the intended correct response; falling back upon Navy jargon, mine was "who is the dishwasher?" I initially thought it not quite similar enough and ruled it incorrect; after visiting the link in the clue, I think it might have been acceptable, but I'm not completely certain.
Last edited by mfc248 on Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Saturnalia »

"The 19th century industrial age gave us roller milling, making white this more available to the masses."

Contestant answer was "bread" and was accepted. I said "flour," and think I have a case. Judges?

(FWIW, it sounds to me like Johanna did respond to the Newton Q in the proper form, but there was an edit or technical gaffe... her response sounds cut at the beginning, at least to my ears.)

Response I'm irritated with myself for not being able to pull: Bill Sykes. I've only seen the film (and that only once), but I loved it...
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by thenextofken »

9021amyers wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:00 pm Surely, Deliverance isn’t the worst guess to make for today’s Final.
No, because I considered it as well.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by thenextofken »

Leander wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:45 pm My hearing may be going, but I would swear Johanna left off “ what is” in her answer to the Newton question. I also thought she missed it on her Bell answer, but she might have muttered it under her breath.
I thought the same thing. My thought was she said it so quickly that maybe it got edited out. Otherwise, how could this get by the judges TWICE in DJ?
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Anachronism »

thenextofken wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:36 pm
Leander wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:45 pm My hearing may be going, but I would swear Johanna left off “ what is” in her answer to the Newton question. I also thought she missed it on her Bell answer, but she might have muttered it under her breath.
I thought the same thing. My thought was she said it so quickly that maybe it got edited out. Otherwise, how could this get by the judges TWICE in DJ?
I think they were editing closely to make room for the cartoon commercial in SJ. Perhaps they're aware of the criticism over all the unrevealed clues earlier this season due to this zeal for additional revenue. Funny that no one knew that answer after that agonizingly long excerpt. I sure didn't.

Pre-called FJ, figured it fit well enough to be the answer.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Golf »

jeff6286 wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:11 pm I have no problem with Wes's wager. He can't win if second place makes what we would generally consider to be the optimal wager. So he can either hope second bets all/most of their money and bet less than $4800 to stay ahead of first on a miss, or he can bet it all and hope 2nd bets at least $1600. Historically, 2nd is probably more likely to bet all (or nearly all) than they are to bet something just between $1600 and $3200, but I can't blame him for wanting to add the most he can to narrow the gap on second and hope for the best.
You're right, he can't win if second makes the optimal wager. But his wager means he still can't win if second makes the optimal wager nor can he win on a TS. How often is second going to wager between $1599 and $8000 giving his all in a fighting chance? How often is the leader going to wager an amount that gives him a chance on a double up but no chance on a zero wager?

It's OK to have no problem or not blame him on the wager, but it's still extremely sub-optimal.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by twelvefootboy »

This was a nice game and likable players. I'm terrible at faces, but Johanna sure looks like Cher to me, and not just the big hair. Either that or she looks like Ryan Seachrist from Morbeedo's TD ;).

I was disappointed I couldn't reconcile the variable stars clue in Science and Math, and then flabbergasted that they put up a parabola equation. I'm not so sure that parabolas are involved in bridges - certainly catenary shapes are, which resemble them but have a totally different equation form with hyperbolic functions. Plenty of TOM with the conic sections hint, but still - that is a YEKIOYD clue.

I came up with "Hunt for Red Octob" as well, and it is such a perfect byname for the story as I know it. I did like Alex's little quip about Benchley's father.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by LucarioSnooperVixey »

43 R
DD: 2/3 (Drive Drunk, Pangaea)
FJ: :mrgreen:
LT: (Drive Drunk), Norman Bates, Adam Sandler, Trojan War, Parabola, Metal Detector, Golden Gate, Macaroni Club
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by LucarioSnooperVixey »

Wpwells wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:54 am Ugh ugh ugh. I thought it was too late for this, but I went with Silent Spring. Ugh ugh ugh.
The category was 1970's BESTSELLERS. Silent Spring was released in 1962.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by MattKnowles »

I considered Jaws but went with Silent Spring. If I had known Silent Spring was published in the 60s I would have gotten it right.

For the daily double I guessed "drink and drive" instead of "drive drunk." I think they were looking for a specific phrase so that would have been marked wrong.
Golf wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:49 pm
jeff6286 wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:11 pm I have no problem with Wes's wager. He can't win if second place makes what we would generally consider to be the optimal wager. So he can either hope second bets all/most of their money and bet less than $4800 to stay ahead of first on a miss, or he can bet it all and hope 2nd bets at least $1600. Historically, 2nd is probably more likely to bet all (or nearly all) than they are to bet something just between $1600 and $3200, but I can't blame him for wanting to add the most he can to narrow the gap on second and hope for the best.
You're right, he can't win if second makes the optimal wager. But his wager means he still can't win if second makes the optimal wager nor can he win on a TS. How often is second going to wager between $1599 and $8000 giving his all in a fighting chance? How often is the leader going to wager an amount that gives him a chance on a double up but no chance on a zero wager?

It's OK to have no problem or not blame him on the wager, but it's still extremely sub-optimal.
Can anybody with a database actually get the statistics for this?

This is a 4/5 scenario where 3rd place cannot cover second place. What is the probability for cases 1, 2, and 3 where case 1 is that second place bets less than the difference between their score and double third place's score, case 2 is that second place bets more than that value and less than the difference between their score and third place's score, and case 3 is when second place bets more than that.

Golf and jeff6286 both agree that case 3 is more likely than case 2. Is that actually correct?
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by TenPoundHammer »

I bit on the "do drugs"/"drive drunk" negbait. Such an easy trap.

Ran the Hotel category.

"Colorful berries" in the top box could be any of them.

Couldn't think of a condition that "yoked" could be. I thought they wanted a medical condition.

Well how am I supposed to... oh duh, 1970s. What's a 1970s novel that might take place in the water? Jaws it is.

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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by Rackme32 »

Ironhorse wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:53 pm Box of shame avoided. Surprised that wasn't a triple get.
This.

I considered Silent Spring for maybe three seconds, but then remembered it was an early 60's book, from my many times shelving the thing in a non-fiction section while a student library assistant.

This remembering book/author/subject from my time on that job over 40 years ago happens surprisingly often with me, despite the fact I am *not* a voracious reader... I get the occasional strange stares from trivia teammates when I do that. Wish I could make it happen *all* the time... Might get me on J! But there's no way. :(
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by BigDaddyMatty »

MattKnowles wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:23 am For the daily double I guessed "drink and drive" instead of "drive drunk." I think they were looking for a specific phrase so that would have been marked wrong.
That's right. They were looking for the tagline to this ad campaign:
Sprinkles are for winners.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by cheezguyty »

MattKnowles wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:23 am
Golf wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 11:49 pm
jeff6286 wrote: Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:11 pm I have no problem with Wes's wager. He can't win if second place makes what we would generally consider to be the optimal wager. So he can either hope second bets all/most of their money and bet less than $4800 to stay ahead of first on a miss, or he can bet it all and hope 2nd bets at least $1600. Historically, 2nd is probably more likely to bet all (or nearly all) than they are to bet something just between $1600 and $3200, but I can't blame him for wanting to add the most he can to narrow the gap on second and hope for the best.
You're right, he can't win if second makes the optimal wager. But his wager means he still can't win if second makes the optimal wager nor can he win on a TS. How often is second going to wager between $1599 and $8000 giving his all in a fighting chance? How often is the leader going to wager an amount that gives him a chance on a double up but no chance on a zero wager?

It's OK to have no problem or not blame him on the wager, but it's still extremely sub-optimal.
Can anybody with a database actually get the statistics for this?

This is a 4/5 scenario where 3rd place cannot cover second place. What is the probability for cases 1, 2, and 3 where case 1 is that second place bets less than the difference between their score and double third place's score, case 2 is that second place bets more than that value and less than the difference between their score and third place's score, and case 3 is when second place bets more than that.

Golf and jeff6286 both agree that case 3 is more likely than case 2. Is that actually correct?
I have the percentages at 48.3% for case 1, 9.4% for case 2, and 38.0% for case 3 (plus 3.8% for wagering exactly the difference between second and double third and 0.6% for wagering exactly the difference between second and third).
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by This Is Kirk! »

Did some of you think Silent Spring was actually a novel or did you just fail to parse that bit of the clue? I'm just curious, because I'm guilty of botching plenty of FJs myself. For example last week I said Mary Shelley for a category that specified an American Author.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by seaborgium »

TenPoundHammer wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:35 am "Colorful berries" in the top box could be any of them.
Haaaaah. Not if you watch Jeopardy regularly and recognize that when the writers shoehorn "colorful" into a clue it means the correct response is going to have a color in its name.
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by MattKnowles »

cheezguyty wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:23 am I have the percentages at 48.3% for case 1, 9.4% for case 2, and 38.0% for case 3 (plus 3.8% for wagering exactly the difference between second and double third and 0.6% for wagering exactly the difference between second and third).
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Re: Thursday, July 12, 2018 Game Recap and Discussion [SPOILERS]

Post by TenPoundHammer »

seaborgium wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:33 am
TenPoundHammer wrote: Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:35 am "Colorful berries" in the top box could be any of them.
Haaaaah. Not if you watch Jeopardy regularly and recognize that when the writers shoehorn "colorful" into a clue it means the correct response is going to have a color in its name.
Oh duh. Straw, rasp, and boysen aren't colors.
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