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seaborgium
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by seaborgium »

The one closer/est to Alex (physically, not emotionally).
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silverscreentest
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by silverscreentest »

ACW wrote:May have asked this :oops:
But who picks first for DJ! if there's a tie for last place?
I thought they would go back to the most recent point where there wasn't a tie.
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dhkendall
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

silverscreentest wrote:
ACW wrote:May have asked this :oops:
But who picks first for DJ! if there's a tie for last place?
I thought they would go back to the most recent point where there wasn't a tie.
That's what I thought too, and I thought it was confirmed as such on the board, but Stefan pointed out in a recent post (and in the reply just above) that it's the leftmost one.

I'll admit, I haven't seen definitive evidence for either (or at least I haven't paid too much attention), but Stefan's been proven to be very knowledgeable, so I usually trust him on such matters. However, having said that: Stefan, is there definitive proof for this? (Citations of games where the left most player went first, despite the rightmost player having been more recently ahead would be fine, but if there's any external word (like statements from CCs and/or TPTB) would be even better.)
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seaborgium
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by seaborgium »

dhkendall wrote:(Citations of games where the left most player went first, despite the rightmost player having been more recently ahead would be fine, but if there's any external word (like statements from CCs and/or TPTB) would be even better.)
Despite the rightmost player having been more recently ahead? If they did it based on the last un-tied scores, wouldn't they give control to the player who had been most recently behind? Anyway, I've got an example of the more recently behind and the more recently ahead player each getting to select from a tied second, and you'll never guess what they had in common!

In my second game (three years ago today) I was tied with Sarah for second entering DJ. I had just made my way back up to her level after a $4,800 TDD neg, so I had been in third most recently. I selected. In 2006 ToC final game 1, Bill and Vik were tied for second entering DJ. Bill had negged on the final clue of the J! round, a triple stumper, so Vik had been in third most recently. As archived, Bill selected. Both of us were at the left (viewers' POV, of course).

I managed to pull that up with Google. http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%2 ... eresponses

It's such a trivial matter that I doubt TPTB would ever bother to give an official word on the procedure. But I do feel like Alex has actually said it explicitly, like "X and Y are tied, and since X is farther left, s/he will go first."
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trainman
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by trainman »

seaborgium wrote:But I do feel like Alex has actually said it explicitly, like "X and Y are tied, and since X is farther left, s/he will go first."
I'll back you up that he has said this in the past, but I can't cite an exact date.
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by ACW »

Where, and how many, are the judges?
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Case
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by Case »

ACW wrote:Where, and how many, are the judges?
They sat at a table in front of the Johnny Gilbert side of the audience, and there were other people there, like the guy who hits the ring-in lights. From my seat with the other contestants, I couldn't see the judges at all, and when I was on stage practicing, the only one at the table was the light guy. I suppose they took their seats just before the taping started, but I never noticed them at all, so I couldn't even give you an accurate count of judges.
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

Case wrote:
ACW wrote:Where, and how many, are the judges?
They sat at a table in front of the Johnny Gilbert side of the audience, and there were other people there, like the guy who hits the ring-in lights. From my seat with the other contestants, I couldn't see the judges at all, and when I was on stage practicing, the only one at the table was the light guy. I suppose they took their seats just before the taping started, but I never noticed them at all, so I couldn't even give you an accurate count of judges.
I believe they are sometimes seen before a commercial break (when the camera wide-pans the stage), they have lots of monitors in front of them.
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

I'm wondering if you can at all challenge a ruling - I'm not talking about Barbara Lowe, of course, but rather during a commercial break or when a DD is uncovered. I seem to have recalled hearing some stories about being able to do something like raise your hand and ask "can you have the judges check my answer of X a little while ago to confirm that's wrong? Because I know I've heard my answer given in that context before." I get the impression (and I think TPTB wants me to have this impression) that all ruling reversals were the result solely of the judges having second thoughts during the commercial break, researching, and ruling the player right, but I'm wondering if brinigng forth your own reasons as to why your answer is indeed correct and asking the judges to verify it is allowed. (Two other big strikes against it is the tremendous hassle it'd be if such a "time out" was called during game play (at a DD reveal, which is, if I remember the original comment, when it's allowed), and the standard disclaimer on the forms that "the decision of the judges is final", which flies in the face of this ability to question them.)
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Case
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by Case »

dhkendall wrote:I'm wondering if you can at all challenge a ruling - I'm not talking about Barbara Lowe, of course, but rather during a commercial break or when a DD is uncovered. I seem to have recalled hearing some stories about being able to do something like raise your hand and ask "can you have the judges check my answer of X a little while ago to confirm that's wrong? Because I know I've heard my answer given in that context before." I get the impression (and I think TPTB wants me to have this impression) that all ruling reversals were the result solely of the judges having second thoughts during the commercial break, researching, and ruling the player right, but I'm wondering if brinigng forth your own reasons as to why your answer is indeed correct and asking the judges to verify it is allowed. (Two other big strikes against it is the tremendous hassle it'd be if such a "time out" was called during game play (at a DD reveal, which is, if I remember the original comment, when it's allowed), and the standard disclaimer on the forms that "the decision of the judges is final", which flies in the face of this ability to question them.)
Maggie said specifically that we could challenge, but please do it at the break and not right when we were ruled incorrect. She gave an example about saying, "No, Alex, you're wrong; I'm correct" (is that the Lowe example you meant?) and said "please don't do that." Maggie did say that anything questionable would be immediately looked into by the judges, so as to prevent a DD problem later.
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

Case wrote:
dhkendall wrote:I'm wondering if you can at all challenge a ruling - I'm not talking about Barbara Lowe, of course, but rather during a commercial break or when a DD is uncovered. I seem to have recalled hearing some stories about being able to do something like raise your hand and ask "can you have the judges check my answer of X a little while ago to confirm that's wrong? Because I know I've heard my answer given in that context before." I get the impression (and I think TPTB wants me to have this impression) that all ruling reversals were the result solely of the judges having second thoughts during the commercial break, researching, and ruling the player right, but I'm wondering if brinigng forth your own reasons as to why your answer is indeed correct and asking the judges to verify it is allowed. (Two other big strikes against it is the tremendous hassle it'd be if such a "time out" was called during game play (at a DD reveal, which is, if I remember the original comment, when it's allowed), and the standard disclaimer on the forms that "the decision of the judges is final", which flies in the face of this ability to question them.)
Maggie said specifically that we could challenge, but please do it at the break and not right when we were ruled incorrect. She gave an example about saying, "No, Alex, you're wrong; I'm correct" (is that the Lowe example you meant?) and said "please don't do that." Maggie did say that anything questionable would be immediately looked into by the judges, so as to prevent a DD problem later.
So they do encourage that, huh? Mildly surprised. How would one do so if there isn't a break between your theft of points and the DD reveal (especially pertinent to DJ!)?

And, a related question: from what you've seen in the studio (I don't know how many reversals you saw), what percentage of the reversals were contestant-instigated?
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Case
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by Case »

dhkendall wrote: So they do encourage that, huh? Mildly surprised. How would one do so if there isn't a break between your theft of points and the DD reveal (especially pertinent to DJ!)?

And, a related question: from what you've seen in the studio (I don't know how many reversals you saw), what percentage of the reversals were contestant-instigated?


I was there for the taping of eight games, and they twice stopped the game to check a response. Both times it was instigated by the judges and I think it affected the game once. I'll be very interested to see the games broadcast to see how closely they match my memory. Not very closely, I should think. Erin (Treehuggincowgirl) has a much better memory for exactly what happened in which game; maybe she can pop in to add more.

About your first question: I would think that the DD would constitute a break where you could wave frantically to the CC and they would stop taping. At least, I would do that. Since the camera is on the DD contestant, that seems logical, but I didn't see it happen.

The longest break came when a contestant's microphone blew out twice. Mitch the microphone dude (REALLY nice guy, btw) has a set of five ready to go all the time, so he used all of them during that one game. I imagine there's tons more in the back, but rewiring the contestant twice apparently put the game way over schedule and they really rushed through that game and the next one. There was just no time to linger between games (not that they did much lingering anyway), but this time we were herded around even faster than usual.
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by Cortana431 »

If you are selected for the College Tournament, does that mean you can never appear in the future as an Adult contestant?
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dhkendall
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

Cortana431 wrote:If you are selected for the College Tournament, does that mean you can never appear in the future as an Adult contestant?
You cannot appear on the show if you've appeared before in any Trebek-hosted episode.

So, no.
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Magna
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by Magna »

What about that April Fool's show that Pat Sajak hosted? I don't know if Lori Drummond is still around, but she made her first and only appearance on that show.
http://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=226

This is just an academic question of course. :)
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by jeff6286 »

Continuing this thread of random questions, and related to the previous question, here's something that I think could provoke interesting discussion. It came up a while back that someone at a taping indicated that the eligibility rules could change if at some point a new host takes over for Alex Trebek on Jeopardy! Some suggested that this could mean that any player who appeared on the Trebek version of the show could once again be eligible for another appearance. I find this hard to believe, as even if they relax the previous restrictions, it seems unlikely that all 300+ TOC participants would just suddenly be eligible to re-join the contestant pool, including all those who appeared in Super Jeopardy, the Ultimate TOC, etc. So I wonder what possible variation they might make to the eligibility rules short of saying that all previous contestants are now eligible again?

If it were up to me, I might institute a rule that anyone who appeared on just one episode would be eligible for a repeat appearance, likely with some kind of time limit, like perhaps their appearance had to be at least 3 or 5 years ago. This way, all participants in regular games who lost in their only appearance would be allowed to make another attempt, as well as any participant in a Seniors, College, or Teen tourney who failed to advance out of the quarterfinals. (Any Seniors' Tournament participant still able to pass the test would be quite impressive!) Kids' Week contestants who only played one game, win or lose, could also be allowed to return. This could allow the show, if the producers want to go this route, to think up some interesting types of "theme weeks" of regular shows. There could be an entire week of shows where all 10 challengers lost to Ken Jennings in their only appearance. They could do a week where all challengers lost their games in some kind of heartbreaking fashion. Other than boneheaded wagers, I'm not sure what kind of heartbreaking ways there are to lose on Jeopardy!, but maybe things like improper phrasing, misspelling, or some other minor error in FJ that cost a player a victory in their sole previous appearance. There could be a week where all challengers were previous Teen or Kids' Week contestants all grown up now, though that idea has been already used in the past.

Anyone have any other ideas of how they might tweak the rules short of just making everyone eligible again, assuming of course that they feel the need to change them at all?
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by MarkBarrett »

jeff6286 wrote:
Anyone have any other ideas of how they might tweak the rules short of just making everyone eligible again, assuming of course that they feel the need to change them at all?
After Barker retired TPIR said people could be eligible again if they had not appeared in the last 10 years.

If there comes a time that Alex retires and J! continues then we can only speculate on what will happen:

1. No change - You were on with Trebek that's your one shot
2. Everybody is now eligible again - even Ken
3. Eligible again after 2, 5, 7, 10 whatever number of years since previous appearance
4. Winners are not eligible.
5. Only 2nd or 3rd place players in their only game are eligible
6. Only those that appeared on one and done games like kids week are eligible
7. Jeff Kirby don't even think about it
8. I can't imagine any kind of TOC/UTOC distinction used.
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dhkendall
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by dhkendall »

MarkBarrett wrote:
jeff6286 wrote:
Anyone have any other ideas of how they might tweak the rules short of just making everyone eligible again, assuming of course that they feel the need to change them at all?
After Barker retired TPIR said people could be eligible again if they had not appeared in the last 10 years.

If there comes a time that Alex retires and J! continues then we can only speculate on what will happen:

1. No change - You were on with Trebek that's your one shot
2. Everybody is now eligible again - even Ken
3. Eligible again after 2, 5, 7, 10 whatever number of years since previous appearance
4. Winners are not eligible.
5. Only 2nd or 3rd place players in their only game are eligible
6. Only those that appeared on one and done games like kids week are eligible
7. Jeff Kirby don't even think about it
8. I can't imagine any kind of TOC/UTOC distinction used.
#1 seems the most likely, as that's how the contract is currently worded. Adding a TPIR like stipulation ante- Trebek is mainly for the sake of post-Alex contestants.

Besides bringing back any previous contestant for any reason deprives someone else a chance and we don't want that!
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jeff6286
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by jeff6286 »

MarkBarrett wrote: 7. Jeff Kirby don't even think about it
So you're saying you don't believe in "Third time's a charm"? Or just not in that tie?
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Re: 3 Utterly Random Questions

Post by alamble »

MarkBarrett wrote: 7. Jeff Kirby don't even think about it.
Yeah, because that worked so well the first time they tried it.
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