Thursday, June 6, 2019 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

[yclept]

Darn! While there will be plenty of competition for James in the TOC, having a super champ POTENTIALLY meet the person responsible for defeating him in the finals (I assume they would have kept James and Emma apart!) of a TOC would have been fun.

When Emma made the $6,000 wager, it sounded impressive - going for the lead from well behind. Some refuse to do that - in retrospect, however, she should have put more on the line, but it ultimately would not have mattered.

That said, it is just the way the game is normally played - tough to begrudge anyone for playing the game the way it was played (with a few exceptions) for the past 35 years.

Alex jinxed the super champions. We now won’t have one until Season 38.

[seaborgium]

I liked Emma and was rooting for her to make the ToC, but I liked all three contestants in this exciting game and would have been OK with any of them winning.

Just because I'm in denial about it being a losing battle: Emma definitely said "Asterisk", not "Asterix".

Emma got away with "Asterisk" and "moody disorder", which both should have been negged.

I thought she was separating final D from initial D, so that the end of "mood" would be clearly heard.

[Jaksiel]

I thought the GEICO clue was kind of gross. It was pretty much the same as one of the 'fake' GEICO clues they do in the last commercial break.

[1stlvlthinker]

Another retail miss for me, as I've never been to Williams Sonoma and don't know what they sell.

That's because there aren't any Williams-Sonoma stores in dead malls. A high-end cookware place is going to be one of the first to close when a mall starts going downhill. When my Williams-Sonoma gets replaced by a locally owned comic book and trading card store, I know the hammer will soon be tracking that mall.

Hey, now, I have been to high-end malls too. I just don't go in the stores because I won't be able to afford anything they sell. They'd probably turn me down at the door for wearing a Rick and Morty shirt.

And dead malls that USED to be high-end. Look up Forest Fair Village sometime.

Go in the next day dressed up all nice and Pretty Woman those salespeople.

Pretty Woman is a Julia Roberts movie, you should watch it to understand the context.

[alietr]

I wonder if a calmer Emma, one who had bet at least $201 more on DD3, might have worked her way to the right response. This is a tough loss for someone who could have gone a lot farther.

I think she might have if she had written it down left-handed.

The whole left-handed crossword thing was counterintuitive to me -- when I do crosswords, I try to go as fast as possible, but do double check to maintain accuracy. In fact, at crossword tournaments, they give lefties an additional set of clues so we're not covering them up when we write in the grid. So it's definitely a disadvantage for a lefty when doing a crossword by hand.

Well done, Emma. A great, albeit abbreviated, run. I hope it was everything you were hoping for.

[gnash]

I thought of Arlo but only in the context of wondering what they'd do with "Who is Guthrie?" I was hoping one of the three would try it so I could find out. I'm definitely on the side that says there's no way they should accept it, and I doubt they would. I also agree that a pre-FJ instruction would have tipped their hand too much.

I was down between Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger - went with Pete Seeger. However, if I had got pre-instructions about needing a first and last name, it would have been an instaget for Woody Guthrie. If someone had just written "Guthrie" by itself, I also think they would
have to rule against it.

The existence of Bob Seger complicates this line of reasoning. Steinbeck is a far stronger hint.

[gnash]

I liked Emma and was rooting for her to make the ToC, but I liked all three contestants in this exciting game and would have been OK with any of them winning.

Just because I'm in denial about it being a losing battle: Emma definitely said "Asterisk", not "Asterix".

Emma got away with "Asterisk" and "moody disorder", which both should have been negged.

I thought she was separating final D from initial D, so that the end of "mood" would be clearly heard.

My wife and I both heard "moody". Alex used to prompt "say it again" when something was unclear as in your description. I suspect his hearing has deteriorated with age and he now has to rely on judges.

There was no reason to even say the word "disorders".

[squarekara]

Another retail miss for me, as I've never been to Williams Sonoma and don't know what they sell.

That's because there aren't any Williams-Sonoma stores in dead malls. A high-end cookware place is going to be one of the first to close when a mall starts going downhill. When my Williams-Sonoma gets replaced by a locally owned comic book and trading card store, I know the hammer will soon be tracking that mall.

Hey, now, I have been to high-end malls too. I just don't go in the stores because I won't be able to afford anything they sell. They'd probably turn me down at the door for wearing a Rick and Morty shirt.

And dead malls that USED to be high-end. Look up Forest Fair Village sometime.

Go in the next day dressed up all nice and Pretty Woman those salespeople.

Pretty Woman is a Julia Roberts movie, you should watch it to understand the context.

And please watch far enough into the movie not to get picked up by the vice squad.

[gnash]

Well done, Emma. A great, albeit abbreviated, run. I hope it was everything you were hoping for.

I'll bet you any amount that Emma's response would be "no". Of course such a knowledgeable and well-prepared contestant had to have been hoping to qualify for the TOC. I am sure she's also rational and knows that her run was very successful and beat the odds. But she had to have been hoping for more. In fact, other than Brad Rutter - and Ken Jennings before his run began - it's hard to think of any contestant for whom I would say for sure they weren't hoping for more than they achieved.

[opusthepenguin]

I hear what people are hearing as the y in moody. But it comes across very clearly to me as an enunciated terminal d. It's so clear to me that, if the clue had been looking for "moody", I think they'd have to neg her.

[This Is Kirk!]

I thought of Arlo but only in the context of wondering what they'd do with "Who is Guthrie?" I was hoping one of the three would try it so I could find out. I'm definitely on the side that says there's no way they should accept it, and I doubt they would. I also agree that a pre-FJ instruction would have tipped their hand too much.

I was down between Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger - went with Pete Seeger. However, if I had got pre-instructions about needing a first and last name, it would have been an instaget for Woody Guthrie. If someone had just written "Guthrie" by itself, I also think they would
have to rule against it.

The existence of Bob Seger complicates this line of reasoning. Steinbeck is a far stronger hint.

Not if you know the two spell their names differently, though.

[opusthepenguin]

I thought of Arlo but only in the context of wondering what they'd do with "Who is Guthrie?" I was hoping one of the three would try it so I could find out. I'm definitely on the side that says there's no way they should accept it, and I doubt they would. I also agree that a pre-FJ instruction would have tipped their hand too much.

I was down between Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger - went with Pete Seeger. However, if I had got pre-instructions about needing a first and last name, it would have been an instaget for Woody Guthrie. If someone had just written "Guthrie" by itself, I also think they would
have to rule against it.

The existence of Bob Seger complicates this line of reasoning. Steinbeck is a far stronger hint.

Not if you know the two spell their names differently, though.

Doesn't matter. If Bob Seger didn't exist, "Who is Seger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Pete Seeger. If Pete Seeger didn't exist, "Who is Seeger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Bob Seger. So if this clue had been looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" wouldn't have been enough. Because of Bob. But "Who is Pete Seger?" would have been fine. Hence, Gnash's point. A pre-FJ instruction to use a full name (or at least include a first initial) might not be enough to eliminate P. Seeger and steer one toward W. Guthrie.

[This Is Kirk!]

I thought of Arlo but only in the context of wondering what they'd do with "Who is Guthrie?" I was hoping one of the three would try it so I could find out. I'm definitely on the side that says there's no way they should accept it, and I doubt they would. I also agree that a pre-FJ instruction would have tipped their hand too much.

I was down between Woody Guthrie and Pete Seeger - went with Pete Seeger. However, if I had got pre-instructions about needing a first and last name, it would have been an instaget for Woody Guthrie. If someone had just written "Guthrie" by itself, I also think they would
have to rule against it.

The existence of Bob Seger complicates this line of reasoning. Steinbeck is a far stronger hint.

Not if you know the two spell their names differently, though.

Doesn't matter. If Bob Seger didn't exist, "Who is Seger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Pete Seeger. If Pete Seeger didn't exist, "Who is Seeger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Bob Seger. So if this clue had been looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" wouldn't have been enough. Because of Bob. But "Who is Pete Seger?" would have been fine.

I think you're wrong about that. Of course "who is Seeger" would be acceptable for Pete Seeger. I don't think special instructions would have been needed if the correct response had been either Seger or Seeger. I just can't imagine "ooh, sorry, we can't take just Seeger because you could be misspelling Seger" happening.

[Peter the accountant]

Missed this episode (thanks again, KABC and NBA), so only read FJ here. I was way out in the weeds. I never heard the quote from Steinbeck, so couldn't solve it directly. The best I could do was tie in to the beginnings of the civil rights movement in the 50s. (Which, in hindsight, is the right general direction.) I didn't think Steinbeck was alive in the 60's, so that's a fail on my part. I was going down the track of Black musicians, which had me thinking of Otis Redding and BB King. Picked BB, since I was sure he played guitar. But I was too far down the Jazz rabbit hole and not enough on the Folk (and potentially not-black) side of things.

That Oklahoma connection between Steinbeck and Woody makes no sense to me. (Sorry for sounding like TPH here.) Yes, Woodie is from there and Steinbeck wrote some obscure novel about people from Oklahoma. But that's a pretty darn low TOM, if you ask me.

[econgator]

Doesn't matter. If Bob Seger didn't exist, "Who is Seger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Pete Seeger. If Pete Seeger didn't exist, "Who is Seeger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Bob Seger. So if this clue had been looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" wouldn't have been enough. Because of Bob. But "Who is Pete Seger?" would have been fine. Hence, Gnash's point. A pre-FJ instruction to use a full name (or at least include a first initial) might not be enough to eliminate P. Seeger and steer one toward W. Guthrie.

I'm with Kirk here. They do exist, so you can't just ignore them. If the clue was looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" MUST be acceptable That's his last name. The fact that Bob Seger pronounces his name similarly is irrelevant.

[gnash]

Doesn't matter. If Bob Seger didn't exist, "Who is Seger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Pete Seeger. If Pete Seeger didn't exist, "Who is Seeger?" would be a completely acceptable response for Bob Seger. So if this clue had been looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" wouldn't have been enough. Because of Bob. But "Who is Pete Seger?" would have been fine. Hence, Gnash's point. A pre-FJ instruction to use a full name (or at least include a first initial) might not be enough to eliminate P. Seeger and steer one toward W. Guthrie.

I'm with Kirk here. They do exist, so you can't just ignore them. If the clue was looking for Pete Seeger, "Who is Seeger?" MUST be acceptable That's his last name. The fact that Bob Seger pronounces his name similarly is irrelevant.

You are both missing the point Opus and I were making. The assumption is that special instructions were given. (I can bet on the exact wording on the instructions: "Be very specific!") Therefore, neither Seeger nor Seger would be acceptable for Pete Seeger. (Without such instructions, clearly both would be.) And the question that started this subthread was whether the special instruction helped choose Guthrie over Seeger. It did not.

[This Is Kirk!]

And the question that started this subthread was whether the special instruction helped choose Guthrie over Seeger. It did not.

Well, I think it did. They wouldn't have needed to give special instructions had the actual correct response been Seeger, a name that is spelled differently than Seger.

[brick]

Another retail miss for me, as I've never been to Williams Sonoma and don't know what they sell.

That's because there aren't any Williams-Sonoma stores in dead malls. A high-end cookware place is going to be one of the first to close when a mall starts going downhill. When my Williams-Sonoma gets replaced by a locally owned comic book and trading card store, I know the hammer will soon be tracking that mall.

Hey, now, I have been to high-end malls too. I just don't go in the stores because I won't be able to afford anything they sell. They'd probably turn me down at the door for wearing a Rick and Morty shirt.

And dead malls that USED to be high-end. Look up Forest Fair Village sometime.

Go in the next day dressed up all nice and Pretty Woman those salespeople.

Pretty Woman is a Julia Roberts movie, you should watch it to understand the context.

Film. A Julia Roberts film.

[brick]

I hear what people are hearing as the y in moody. But it comes across very clearly to me as an enunciated terminal d. It's so clear to me that, if the clue had been looking for "moody", I think they'd have to neg her.

I hear the same thing as this learned penguin.

[gnash]

And the question that started this subthread was whether the special instruction helped choose Guthrie over Seeger. It did not.

Well, I think it did. They wouldn't have needed to give special instructions had the actual correct response been Seeger, a name that is spelled differently than Seger.

You can't be ruled wrong for misspelling that can reasonably be pronounced as the correct answer, let alone for one that actually is pronounced the same. Therefore, the fact that Pete Seeger and Bob Seger spell their last names differently is completely irrelevant.