New old games in the J! Archive

This is where all of the games are discussed.

Moderators: alietr, trainman, econgator, dhkendall

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

MarkBarrett wrote:
Sun Jul 04, 2021 4:55 pm
Not that I'm very good at it, I hear, "My heavens".
That's definitely it

User avatar
MarkBarrett
Watches Jeopardy! Way Too Much
Posts: 12445
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:37 am
Location: San Francisco

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by MarkBarrett »

I added 5/22/89: https://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=7070

Player pics of Nancy Doman, Lisa Miller and Phil Bergen:
Spoiler
Image
Image
Image

User avatar
MinnesotaMyron
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2350
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 12:53 pm

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by MinnesotaMyron »

We welcome Alaska's Copper River to the J-Canon.

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

seaborgium wrote:
Wed Jun 02, 2021 6:12 pm
In game 4, I thought Joan's last name was Campbell at first, but Alex calls on her by first and last name when she first rings in, and I thought "Cantor" complicated things, because between C/K and o/e there's four ways to spell that. But as it turns out, this game is fabled, and you can search Joan Kantor in J! Archive despite her not having been archived yet.
What does Alex say after "for who" in Joan's interview?

seaborgium
Undefeated in Reruns
Posts: 7591
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:31 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by seaborgium »

Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:29 am
seaborgium wrote:
Wed Jun 02, 2021 6:12 pm
In game 4, I thought Joan's last name was Campbell at first, but Alex calls on her by first and last name when she first rings in, and I thought "Cantor" complicated things, because between C/K and o/e there's four ways to spell that. But as it turns out, this game is fabled, and you can search Joan Kantor in J! Archive despite her not having been archived yet.
What does Alex say after "for who" in Joan's interview?
"Big sums?"

User avatar
econgator
Let's Go Mets!
Posts: 9597
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:32 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by econgator »

seaborgium wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 3:22 am
Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:29 am
seaborgium wrote:
Wed Jun 02, 2021 6:12 pm
In game 4, I thought Joan's last name was Campbell at first, but Alex calls on her by first and last name when she first rings in, and I thought "Cantor" complicated things, because between C/K and o/e there's four ways to spell that. But as it turns out, this game is fabled, and you can search Joan Kantor in J! Archive despite her not having been archived yet.
What does Alex say after "for who" in Joan's interview?
"Big sums?"
That's what I hear.

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

Thanks. I had it as "big subs", which I could only guess was supposed to be Alex's abbreviation for "big subsidiaries".

What does Alex say with regard to Zachary Taylor after saying "Some sources say he voted once" at 1:15:52?

User avatar
econgator
Let's Go Mets!
Posts: 9597
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:32 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by econgator »

Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 10:35 am
Thanks. I had it as "big subs", which I could only guess was supposed to be Alex's abbreviation for "big subsidiaries".

What does Alex say with regard to Zachary Taylor after saying "Some sources say he voted once" at 1:15:52?
In his own election, by the way?

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

econgator wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:03 am
In his own election, by the way?
Thanks for the assists. The best I could hear out of my computer was "He won an election that way," which didn't make sense to me. The sources I could find say he first voted when he was 62, and that he didn't vote in his own election. However, he would have been 64 in the election of 1848, so if he voted at the age of 62, in 1846, that would have been before his election (a midterm?), leading one to ask why he didn't also vote for himself in 1848.

Bamaman
Also Receiving Votes
Posts: 10918
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2011 1:39 pm

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Bamaman »

Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:27 am
econgator wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:03 am
In his own election, by the way?
Thanks for the assists. The best I could hear out of my computer was "He won an election that way," which didn't make sense to me. The sources I could find say he first voted when he was 62, and that he didn't vote in his own election. However, he would have been 64 in the election of 1848, so if he voted at the age of 62, in 1846, that would have been before his election (a midterm?), leading one to ask why he didn't also vote for himself in 1848.
I’ll be at his grave Saturday. I’ll ask him and see what he says.

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

Doug Miller games 2-4 are in:
#163, aired 1985-04-24
#164, aired 1985-04-25
#165, aired 1985-04-26

Dates are probable, but as we know there was some discrepancy between L.A. airdates and (1-week earlier) airdates in the remaining markets, so we may end up adjusting these dates (I believe Sg's corroborative research related to the delayed-airdate L.A. market?).

Joan's infamous flameout in the last of these games didn't feel as spectacular as I was expecting. She even made a few incremental attempts at a comeback, scoring late-game R's in LITTLE BIG MEN $1000, ARCHITECTURE $400, CARDS $400, and MEDICINE $400. (If she had negged these, she would have ended with -$9,500, or -$19,000 postdoubled.) A $1,000 Daily Double on the second-to-last clue, which already would not have been able to help her, cemented her record minus. Although Joan had 13 W, champ Doug had 10 W. His strategy seemed to be to ring in upon the clue first being revealed (as contestants were allowed to do back in Season 1) for most of the top-of-the-board clues, and just take the neg if he couldn't come up with it. Doug also responded very confidently with some very bad negs (ROCK & ROLL $200 [giving lyrics when the clue was asking for the name of a musical subgenre], 4-WORD PHRASES $400 [giving a six-word phrase instead of, as the category suggested, a four-word one], HISTORY $100 [Chicago for the site of a 1666 fire(!)], SILLY SONGS $300 [the three R's for the name of a tune]).

Other items of note:
- Alex accepted "How about...?" as a correct response question form.
- The buzzer worked differently back then: although you could ring in as soon as the clue was revealed, if you hit the button repeatedly, you were locked out. (See FIRST LINES $400 and HISTORY $200.) Edited to add: Doug Miller tells me that the lockout system was new as of the week of his appearance.
- There seemed to be an automatic applause sign for any get on a bottom-row clue.
- If this article/obituary is the same person (it mentions liking Jeopardy!, although not having been on it, and the resemblance is close enough), Joan Kantor was a recent COVID-19 victim.

seaborgium
Undefeated in Reruns
Posts: 7591
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:31 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by seaborgium »

Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:41 pm
Doug Miller games 2-4 are in:
#163, aired 1985-04-24
#164, aired 1985-04-25
#165, aired 1985-04-26

Dates are probable, but as we know there was some discrepancy between L.A. airdates and (1-week earlier) airdates in the remaining markets, so we may end up adjusting these dates (I believe Sg's corroborative research related to the delayed-airdate L.A. market?).
While the early portions of the season were a week off (airing on KCBS at 4pm), my suspicion is that the latter parts (on KCOP at 7:30 starting Monday, 1/7/85*) were aligned with airings elsewhere in the country. Before I interjected, Doug had previously said in the Facebook J! contestants group that his airdates were April 25-28, then April 26-29 (which each included a Saturday and Sunday); after I explained how I'd dated Bruce Rhodewalt's recording, he said he had based his dates on a receipt for his consolation prize, dated 4/26/85 (dunno how he got 4/25 the first time around), and realized that it made more sense for it to have the date of his last show (i.e., the show where he actually got the consolation prize) than his first.


*When I discovered The Desert Sun in trying to confirm the Bruce Rhodewalt 1 airdate, I looked through for the earliest TV listings for J! that I could find. The TV listings began with 6pm, so it was impossible to see a KCBS listing for J!. Wikipedia said that KCBS replaced J! with Quincy, M.E. reruns two months in, and KCOP picked it up after that. I verified via those TV listings that KCOP started running it the first Monday of 1985, but I can't re-verify right now because UC Riverside's newspaper archive isn't loading images (there was a fire in the building where their data center is and they can't get in to do maintenance).
Robert K S wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 12:41 pm
- If this article/obituary is the same person (it mentions liking Jeopardy!, although not having been on it, and the resemblance is close enough), Joan Kantor was a recent COVID-19 victim.
The obituary says she was born in England, whereas contestant Joan is introduced as being originally from Brooklyn. Plus I don't think the detail of contestant Joan appearing on Love Connection in 1989 is compatible with a wife and mother born in 1945 whose obituary mentions starting a family with "the love of her life".

User avatar
MarkBarrett
Watches Jeopardy! Way Too Much
Posts: 12445
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 10:37 am
Location: San Francisco

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by MarkBarrett »

I cleaned up 12/20/90: https://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=6457

For tomorrow afternoon I call dibs on doing the same thing to 12/21/90.

For available games not archived I show:
3/17 & 3/18/86 Clint Swett

Oct. 11 - 20, 1995 wih 10/18 in that span already in.

The game with the iffy airdate around Feb. 1985

Any others?

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

seaborgium wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:20 pm
The obituary says she was born in England, whereas contestant Joan is introduced as being originally from Brooklyn. Plus I don't think the detail of contestant Joan appearing on Love Connection in 1989 is compatible with a wife and mother born in 1945 whose obituary mentions starting a family with "the love of her life".
Those facts aren't totally compelling to me (it's possible that she had been brought to Brooklyn as a baby, and that her husband Stephen had died young, before Joan went on The Love Connection), but there is one fact in the article that makes me think that this person and our Joan are different people: "Kantor worked in the restaurant industry as a manager and waitress before she retired in her early 60s [i.e., 2005-2010]." It seems unlikely to me that a person who worked as a controller for a men's shirt company would go into waitressing. On the other hand, there are plenty of instances of Jeopardy! contestants who had career changes. I've put in a message to the daughter on Facebook which could confirm/disconfirm.

seaborgium
Undefeated in Reruns
Posts: 7591
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:31 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by seaborgium »

Brooklyn would seem to be worth mentioning in her obituary if she had been raised there, rather than going straight from her English birth to her Canadian life.

I also think there's enough discrepancy between their appearances to rule out their being the same person. The article about Canadian Joan's passing has a picture of her smiling "several years back" (more fully than on her obituary page), and her teeth are different from J! Joan's when she smiles during her introduction (dentures would account for a difference, but Canadian Joan's teeth look grown, not made.)

Edit: I found another article about Canadian Joan that should rule out her being Jeopardy Joan: https://www.barrietoday.com/coronavirus ... 19-2689640
She was born in Derby, England, where she picked up what her obituary referred to as her “marvellous accent.”
It's odd that the obituary available online doesn't mention this, but anyway I wouldn't call J! Joan's accent marvelous (with either number of L's), and I don't think anyone would say that it's English in origin.

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

Tried working up the name through Ancestry and various online databases. There are a ton of present and former Joan Cantors and Joan Kantors out there. Even assuming she was Southern Californian by 1985, tracking down which one of the candidates could be her is more work than I can afford. That she may have subsequently changed her name complicates things considerably.

seaborgium
Undefeated in Reruns
Posts: 7591
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 9:31 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by seaborgium »

Do you know who first gave a report of Joan's Love Connection appearance?

User avatar
Robert K S
Jeopardy! Champion
Posts: 2770
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 pm
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
Contact:

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Robert K S »

seaborgium wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:09 pm
Do you know who first gave a report of Joan's Love Connection appearance?
I don't! I can only imagine it's a detail left on the old Sony message board which I thought at the time to be credible enough to import to the J! Archive, the source of which has since been wiped from the Internet, unless hiding in some inaccessible corner of the Internet Archive.

It looks like it may be possible to be granted beta access to an archive keyword search capability by e-mailing support@archive.org.

animfan
Valued Contributor
Posts: 53
Joined: Sat May 30, 2015 8:54 pm

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by animfan »

I have some requests:

May 4, 1988 (Mark Lowenthal game 1)
May 25, 1988
June 15, 1988 (Stephen Lebowitz game 4)
June 17, 1988
June 20, 1988
July 21, 1988
July 22, 1988 (Season 4 finale)
June 16, 1989 (Cathy Boggs game 1)
June 26, 1990 (Dan Katz game 1)
June 29, 1990 (Dan Katz game 4)
July 2, 1990 (Dan Katz game 5)
July 6, 1990 (Season 6 regular finale)

Jeff-thecdboy
Watches Jeopardy! Way Too Much
Posts: 407
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 9:34 am

Re: New old games in the J! Archive

Post by Jeff-thecdboy »

MarkBarrett wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 5:39 pm
I cleaned up 12/20/90: https://www.j-archive.com/showgame.php?game_id=6457

For tomorrow afternoon I call dibs on doing the same thing to 12/21/90.

For available games not archived I show:
3/17 & 3/18/86 Clint Swett

Oct. 11 - 20, 1995 with 10/18 in that span already in.

The game with the iffy airdate around Feb. 1985

Any others?
October 23, 1995 is now in the same Google Drive link as the other Oct. 1995 episodes as well.

Post Reply