Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

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georgespelvin
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by georgespelvin »

I did not watch this game (but will watch tonight's because a sister of a friend is on) but did the Gene Kelly clue say that "Xanadu" was his last film? One of my Facebook friends said that the clue was written that way. If it was, the clue was wrong--"That's Dancing", a MGM clip movie that came out in 1985 which Kelly co-hosted was his last fim.
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MarkBarrett
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by MarkBarrett »

georgespelvin wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 11:45 am I did not watch this game (but will watch tonight's because a sister of a friend is on) but did the Gene Kelly clue say that "Xanadu" was his last film? One of my Facebook friends said that the clue was written that way. If it was, the clue was wrong--"That's Dancing", a MGM clip movie that came out in 1985 which Kelly co-hosted was his last fim.
Olivia called it an amazing experience working & dancing with this legend on "Xanadu", which would be his last film
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georgespelvin
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by georgespelvin »

That's exactly what my friend said the clue was. This means that the clue is wrong--or at the very least not satisfactorally pinned.

They might have even filmed Gene Kelly's narration spots for "That's Dancing" on one of the studios on the lot. Didn't MGM used to use the lot before Sony took it over?
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Volante
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Volante »

georgespelvin wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 12:31 pm That's exactly what my friend said the clue was. This means that the clue is wrong--or at the very least not satisfactorally pinned.

They might have even filmed Gene Kelly's narration spots for "That's Dancing" on one of the studios on the lot. Didn't MGM used to use the lot before Sony took it over?
Depending how deep in the weeds you want to go, technically "Cats Don't Dance" was his list film, as he worked as a consultant.

No one's legitimately confusing a documentary/hosting appearance with an acting role, though. Not to mention none of those hosting appearances were alongside ONJ.
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georgespelvin
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by georgespelvin »

I did not say that it would have misled people--if you know that Gene Kelly co-hosted "That's Dancing" then you certainly know that he was in "Xanadu" with Olivia Newton John--however the clue is at best sloppily worded and at worst wrong factually because "Xanadu" was not Kelly's last on-screen appearance. It furthers the suppostion that clue writing has become very sloppy lately. Also, it denigrates Jeopardy!'s status as an educational program if it provides incorrect information even if that incorrect information doesn't lead you astray on a clue.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Xu Donym »

georgespelvin wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:04 pm the clue is at best sloppily worded and at worst wrong factually
It seems clear that Jeopardy! clues are now routinely written without regard for standard English-language grammar. It is becoming increasingly common for a clue's desired response to be obvious from context -- "WECIB?" -- but for the clue's wording to rule out that desired response if you parse the clue using standard English-language grammar. And then there are the increasingly common ambiguities regarding facts that leave an insufficiently pinned clue open to dispute.

In this case, it's as if a clue-writer looked up Gene Kelly in IMDB but didn't realize that "Actor" and "Self" are separate categories under which one can appear in a film, and thus pinned the clue incorrectly even though the response is an easy WECIB?. Disappointing, but increasingly routine.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Woppy T »

mikebdoss wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:36 am
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 4:23 pm
ACW wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:01 pm
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:48 am There's a category "Role in Common" that I'm willing to bet doesn't have one of my toughest questions in it: "This character was played, in movies made 61 years apart, by two unrelated actors with the same last name".

Anyone care to ring in?
No idea. What years were the movies.
1934 and 1995.
Took me about 20 minutes of digging, but I figured it out. No way I was getting that off the top of my head.
Could we get another hint?
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Volante
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Volante »

Xu Donym wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:10 pm
georgespelvin wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:04 pm the clue is at best sloppily worded and at worst wrong factually
It seems clear that Jeopardy! clues are now routinely written without regard for standard English-language grammar. It is becoming increasingly common for a clue's desired response to be obvious from context -- "WECIB?" -- but for the clue's wording to rule out that desired response if you parse the clue using standard English-language grammar. And then there are the increasingly common ambiguities regarding facts that leave an insufficiently pinned clue open to dispute.

In this case, it's as if a clue-writer looked up Gene Kelly in IMDB but didn't realize that "Actor" and "Self" are separate categories under which one can appear in a film, and thus pinned the clue incorrectly even though the response is an easy WECIB?. Disappointing, but increasingly routine.
A&E Biography doesn't care about the English language either I guess
https://www.biography.com/performer/gene-kelly
He made his last film appearance in the 1980 musical fantasy Xanadu with Olivia Newton-John, which proved to be a box-office dud, but a cult classic decades later.
Or the Christian Science Monitor
https://www.csmonitor.com/The-Culture/C ... n-50-years
Tomorrow will be the hundredth anniversary of Gene Kelly’s birth, and it’s been 32 years since his last film appearance (1980’s “Xanadu” – don’t see it, it’s terrible).
I guess the NY Times is a little better... https://www.nytimes.com/1996/02/03/movi ... -dies.html
His last performance on screen was dancing on roller skates in the 1980 movie "Xanadu," with Olivia Newton-John, a reprise of a number he did with his brother, Fred, years earlier. He also reminisced in the 1994 anthology film "That's Entertainment! III."
I'm pretty sure no one was actually confused about what the clue was going for, that when "last film" is used for an actor, they mean...acting. Not as a host or documentary talking head.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by brick »

Woppy T wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:53 pm
mikebdoss wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:36 am
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 4:23 pm
ACW wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:01 pm
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:48 am There's a category "Role in Common" that I'm willing to bet doesn't have one of my toughest questions in it: "This character was played, in movies made 61 years apart, by two unrelated actors with the same last name".

Anyone care to ring in?
No idea. What years were the movies.
1934 and 1995.
Took me about 20 minutes of digging, but I figured it out. No way I was getting that off the top of my head.
Could we get another hint?
Please.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by ACW »

Yeah, I'm at a loss.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by davey »

Cris's not-liking-olives anecdote was lame (especially without specifying green or black!), but it least it got him to smile. His grim game-play is wearing on me - and maybe Ken too, since he noted Cris's scowl at the end...
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Lefty »

da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 4:23 pm
ACW wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:01 pm
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:48 am There's a category "Role in Common" that I'm willing to bet doesn't have one of my toughest questions in it: "This character was played, in movies made 61 years apart, by two unrelated actors with the same last name".

Anyone care to ring in?
No idea. What years were the movies.
1934 and 1995.
I'll allow myself only one guess.
Spoiler
It Happened One Night, with Stephen Colbert starring in the gender-switched remake (only, what was the character's name?)
I'm smart and I want respect.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by mikebdoss »

Woppy T wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:53 pm
mikebdoss wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:36 am
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 4:23 pm
ACW wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:01 pm
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:48 am There's a category "Role in Common" that I'm willing to bet doesn't have one of my toughest questions in it: "This character was played, in movies made 61 years apart, by two unrelated actors with the same last name".

Anyone care to ring in?
No idea. What years were the movies.
1934 and 1995.
Took me about 20 minutes of digging, but I figured it out. No way I was getting that off the top of my head.
Could we get another hint?
The films are based on a classic work of literature. The films also have the same name.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by da Doctah »

mikebdoss wrote: Sat Dec 03, 2022 3:41 am
Woppy T wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:53 pm
mikebdoss wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 1:36 am
da Doctah wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 4:23 pm
ACW wrote: Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:01 pm No idea. What years were the movies.
1934 and 1995.
Took me about 20 minutes of digging, but I figured it out. No way I was getting that off the top of my head.
Could we get another hint?
The films are based on a classic work of literature. The films also have the same name.
That's pretty much the next hint I had lined up. To clarify, both films have the same name as the original work of literature.

Since, as I mentioned, it's a tough one, I'll add a further hint: one of the films was the actor's last feature role, and that actor was a heterochrome.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by brick »

Lefty wrote: Fri Dec 02, 2022 9:48 pm

1934 and 1995.
I'll allow myself only one guess.
Spoiler
It Happened One Night, with Stephen Colbert starring in the gender-switched remake (only, what was the character's name?)
[/quote]

Such a good movie!
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by Robert K S »

Before the hint I spent way too much time looking at the cast of A Kid in King Arthur's Court.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by brick »

Robert K S wrote: Sat Dec 03, 2022 2:48 pm Before the hint I spent way too much time looking at the cast of A Kid in King Arthur's Court.
Never heard of it. Can't be as good as Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's Court, which has a terrific song about doing nothing.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by MattKnowles »

I'm not sure why I went through a list of all the movies released in 1995 but I finally got it.
I had a dream that I was asleep and then I woke up and Jeopardy! was on.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by jeff6286 »

I had a hunch with Hugh Grant possibly playing a role previously played by Cary Grant. And Hugh starred in Sense and Sensibility in 1995, but it does not have a 1930s version and it doesn't seem that Hugh and Cary match up anywhere else.
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Re: Thursday, December 1, 2022 Game Recap and Discussion (SPOILERS)

Post by mikebdoss »

The cool part is that I think it's entirely possible there could be another answer to the original question with different years and different actors, but it'd be very, very difficult to figure out.
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